sneezycheese

1&1's offering credit - is not licenced to do so - you can't check your balance - is not running credit checks - is not providing credit agreements - is not following up on chasing bad debt cause I think they know they'll be in the shit - I know of one person who has ran up a bill of well over £3k in a couple of months with 1&1 without knowing it - and therefore is also breaking ICANN rules (you're not supposed to able to buy a .com on credit acording to ICANN rules and blocking access to domains already paid for is also against the rules), as well as the Nominet Registrar Agreement (blocking access to domains already paid for by not acting 'fairly' to Registrants and allowing Registrants to move .uk domains already paid for - i.e. you have to use Nominet rather than 1&1 to do it).

It's the credit bit that worries me and knowing that Nominet read these forums and that I shall be making them aware of this situation (and I invite others to join me), I would expect Nominet to suspend 1&1's account!

Lets see what happens...

Regards,

Sneezy.

devolution

Yes - I was going to bring this up also... They don't bill you straight away, rather they acrue for some period of time and then charge you later... So you don't always know what the 'bill' will be...

I believe this could be in contravention of some UK laws.... In which case...

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devolution

On another note, it might be worth pursuing action through the EU legal mechanisms... Because the UK is an EU member state and therefore subject to the EU laws also... As it is clear 1&1 operates across Europe, then there might be more luck held by contacting the relevant EU bodies/organizations...

Consumer Affairs
(eg: EUROPA - Consumer Affairs - Information for consumers - Interested in your rights as a consumer? - Unfair commercial practices
EUROPA - Consumer Affairs - Rights - E-shopping)

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pbwf

Seems like we're all in the same boat. I got the demand too even though I cancelled my contract on the day it tried to renew (this was the first I knew anything about it auto-renewing). I couldn't even pay on 1and1 website because I cancelled my contract even though they told me this was the only way to do it!

1and1 are a complete bunch of idiots. They lie cheat and scam the customer and thats the only reason they are still in business. We should try and mount some sort of campaign to have them shut down so people don't have to go through this same misery!

Here's the e-mail I just sent them:

----- Forwarded Message ----
From: Peter ----- <---->
To: complaints@1and1.com
Sent: Thursday, August 7, 2008 12:44:56 AM
Subject: RE: ---- Re: Invoice

Please disregard my previous e-mail. I am back in the US now and my brother has alerted me to the fact that I have received a letter from your debt collection agency. Let me start by saying a big THANK YOU for doing this.

I will continue by saying that I have never dealt with a company so inept in dealing with its customers. You successfully pulled one over on me with your ridiculous policy of renewal. I distinctly do not remember checking an option to have my domain auto renewed. This means that unlike the many reasonable domain name companies out there that do it this way, you snuck in some clause into the fine print. Just when I thought even the low life scum of credit card companies were starting to do away with this, your company proves that there are still new lows to hit in being transparent with policies and getting one over on your customers.

After talking to your customer service last week, I was given the impression that your company did actually care about my business and satisfaction. However this has since proven to be false. Your billing agent told me that my bill HAD NOT been passed to collections and that I had to e-mail your department to proceed further. She also told me that to pay the bill would need to be done online. However, I could not as my account had been cancelled and "did not exist in your system" (according to your own website). Now, either she was lying or the case was subsequently passed to collections which would show yet another mark of the lengths you go to please and work with your customers. Either way it stinks.

Why could you not have provided me with a final balance due when I cancelled my account on May 26th? If I cancel my mobile phone or other utility, I am provided a final bill which is to be paid. Instead I received NOTHING after I cancelled my service until your demand for payment by mail in July, completely inconvenient for me and inconsistent with your usual method of e-mail.

Congratulations on having a company with fractured customer service where one hand fails to communicate with the other, and seems to have the supreme goal of getting one over on the customer.

Please be assured that I will make my views known of your horrible company with its horrible customer service at every available opportunity. Just as you have gone out of your way to make my life difficult I will do the same for your company. I will ensure that all customer review sites and Trading Standards find out the way you operate and my experience.

On a brighter note (for us both perhaps), is that I may now be able to actually pay my bill. Unlike your ridiculous billing system which does not allow me to pay because I cancelled my account, your debt collectors seem to allow various methods of payment. Hopefully then I can stop wasting time and get this dealt with.

Thanks so much again and I look forward to never having anything at all to do with your company. I feel very sorry for your customers who do not know what is ahead for them. Do the world a favour and start looking at how to make your business customer oriented rather than trying to do them over.



----- Forwarded Message ----
From: Peter ---- <---->
To: complaints@1and1.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 6, 2008 5:20:09 PM
Subject: Re: ----- Re: Invoice

Ok, fair enough. Although I do not like your policy in the slightest, to make this problem go away, I am willing to pay the 7.90 due. Now you need to provide me a way to do so. Because I have cancelled my account it will not allow me to login to do so.

Please advise me how I can now pay this account. If I need to call a department, please provide the phone number.

Thanks

Peter -----




----- Original Message ----
From: "complaints@1and1.com" <complaints@1and1.com>
To: -----
Sent: Wednesday, August 6, 2008 5:12:15 PM
Subject: ----- Re: Invoice

Dear Peter -----, (Customer ID: -----)

Thank you for contacting us.

We do not provide email notification for when domains are about to
renew. It would be your responsibility to monitor and maintain your
domain's renewal dates. This is all outlined within the terms and
conditions that you had agreed to upon signing up.

If you have any further questions please do not hesitate to contact us.

--
Sincerely,
Michael -----
Technical Support
1&1 Internet

> Hi
> I am e-mailing you as directed by your member of staff in the billing
department, Nayomi Pirisyalage, because I was sent a letter and bill for
£7.90 for the renewal of a domain name. The letter also remarked that my
case had been passed to collections and the additional sum of £15 would
be due, however your colleague told me that this had not been done.
> I previously cancelled the renewal on the 26th May 2008 when I
received the invoice via e-mail. This was the first e-mail I had
received concerning the renewal. As this was only a temporary website, I
did not want to renew and had not given my consent for this to happen.
> There has been a delay in me responding to the letter because I am
living out of the country and the letter was sent to my parents address
and I only received this last week when I visited. I do not understand
why this was not sent via e-mail as the invoice was. Had this have been
done I would have responded much sooner.
> Please advise how we can proceed with this. I am not prepared to pay
for services which I have not and will not use and cancelled the same
day as I received your invoice.
> If you wish to contact me, please do so via e-mail to this address
or via phone at ----. Please, please do not send any
written letters to my home address.
> Best regards,
> Peter
>
>
>

rob

Just had a call from Nominet - they are checking websites etc to ensure that they are complying with the 'good practice' agreement.

Hopefully this means they will be doing bigger clients such as 1&1

ships

Hi again,

OK, this morning I now have a letter from a company called Smiths - Law,based in London.
It states that 1& 1 are their client and that they have been instructed to assist in the recovery of this so called "debt" of mine. It then goes on to say that full payment must be recieved by Arvato Finance within 15 days, otherwise their client will consider County Court action. It then just says that if that happens, that there will be further costs incurred and give me a total, plus I might get a ccj.
It states that I must NOT contact them, I must only contact Arvato.

Now, I am really confused!! I thought from previous letters that Arvato were chasing me for the "debt " but now it seems to be Smiths. Do any of you guys understand this?
Is Arvato working for 1 & 1 or are Smiths? Smiths state in this letter that their client is 1 & 1. So who are Arvato? Why would Smiths not want the payment?
It just gets more bizzare.
My last dealings with this were 2 weeks ago,when I phoned Arvato,told them I was in disput with 1 & 1, so they put a hold on the account for 2 weeks. Now that time has passed,they are chasing me again.
In that 2 week period, I wrote to 1 & 1 again and told them to tell me exactly what this "debt" is for and to prove it. I heard nothing.
I think I now need to establish,who owns the "debt" If Smiths don't,by Law they need to leave me alone and if Arvato don't, then so do they.
Look forward to your coments.

rob

You mentioned you had filled a complaint against 1 and 1 with Nominet - how did that get on?

njp

HEEEELPPPPP !!!!


1 and 1 internet and Arvarto finance and Smiths.

i am also getting leter from these people sayinh i owe £130.00 for an outstanding payment plus costs


i cancelled my account back in october 2007.

help !! what can i do

paulleahy

Hi njp

How did you get on with that after ?

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ships

Hi,

OK, this is where I am with it. I have not heard from them since 18th August. I wrote to them just after that saying that I want proof of some kind that the debt had been sold to Smiths and I wanted proof that I ticked,signed,whatever a contract with them that tied me in for more than one year.

I have not heard from them since. So,fingers crossed. I told them that I would counter claim and charge them for my time,if they continued to waste it. I want proof of the alleged debt and want to know what its for and suprise,suprise, Nada!!!