.UK Consultation meeting

[websaway]

"We would like to thank everyone who took the time to read the proposals and respond. We received 313 consultation responses, as well as feedback from four roundtable sessions, stakeholder meetings, emails and a webinar.

The feedback will be reviewed by our Board at their next meeting on 29th October. Once a decision has been reached on the way forward, we will publish submissions, where permission has been given to do so, and an assessment of the impact of the current proposal. We expect to publish our update in early November."

Anyone brave enough to make a prediction.

 

[foz]

It's ridiculous that such a decision rests with a handful of individuals, all suckling on the bonus teat.

 

[DomainM]

How soon will we be able to register .uk domains if it goes ahead?

 

[Edwin]

How soon will we be able to register .uk domains if it goes ahead?

That will presumably depend in part on how many lawsuits get launched...

 

[websaway]

What are the odds on a third consultation ?

 

[Retired_Member38]

What are the odds on a third consultation ?

I'm gonna go with 'not very likely'.

I think they either announce how they're going to launch .uk (very likely) or they say they've shelved it for the foreseeable future (unlikely)

 

[Stephen]

Agoraphobia Free

I think they will go with 3rd .uk consultation

But its nice to know if things get bad, Nominet have just provided a £50,000 grant to
http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11259547.htm (press release dated 29 10 13)
for a new app;

Virtually Free Ltd, a UK based technology start-up that develops apps to improve emotional health, has been awarded a major Nominet Trust grant to develop Agoraphobia Free, its latest app to help people suffering from agoraphobia, an extreme fear of situations where escape might be difficult or help might not be available if things go wrong.....

 

[julian]

If Nom want an easy way out surely they just go for a 3rd consultation offering like for like pairing - can't see anyone really needing to moan or taking up lawsuits if they do that?

Then it's just a simple option: you either have your new .UK if you want it, if not then carry on.

I'll stick my neck out.. I reckon good .co.uk domains will go up 10 fold in value with a .UK once the market has restabilized

 

[Retired_Member38]

I wouldn't even think about the lawsuits angle - thats just people on a forum blowing hot air. When push comes to shove... none of them are going to do it as they have absolutely no legal basis for it and the bills from it would be crippling.

 

[julian]

probably very true... and I was thinking they'd be mental not chuck in a '3rd' consultation as an arse covering exercise to help justify the fact its been a thoroughly examined process

I wouldn't even think about the lawsuits angle - thats just people on a forum blowing hot air. When push comes to shove... none of them are going to do it as they have absolutely no legal basis for it and the bills from it would be crippling.

 

[ANY-Web]

I wouldn't even think about the lawsuits angle - thats just people on a forum blowing hot air. When push comes to shove... none of them are going to do it as they have absolutely no legal basis for it and the bills from it would be crippling.

Oh really, Monkey?
First of all there is the 1&2 letter auction names in 2011, which will bring forth an interesting alliance of domain investors and businesses.
Currently the .me.uk names carry the rights to the .uk extension, which must be examined further.

As for all other 10m existing .uk names:
People on this forum and domain investors in general may well weigh up the issue with "you win some, you lose some" and focus on the many opportunities that direct.UK will bring because of an ignorant public badly informed by Nominet.
There will be amazing domains dropping (both .co.uk and .uk) because ordinary business owners cannot be expected to understand the phishing/seo/email redirections implications of the .UK proposal.
(That is the job of Nominet - to be the guardian of the entire UK domain space and protect the public from harm ).

So domain investors will sort out their portfolios one way or another.
However, there are businesses in the real world that will be severely impacted by the current proposals and that cannot take such an attitude.

Just a few examples are here:
http://www.notagreatplacetobe.org.uk/victims/
There are many many others.

There are 500,000+ duplicate strings.
All it takes is for 1% of these people to cry foul and run to their MP or the press or their business association.
That is 5,000 angry business people concerned about the cost for their businesses, or the inability to obtain the matching .UK

Of these aggrieved business people all you need is 1% to take legal action.
That is 50 lawsuits against Nominet potentially.

All you need is for some of these 50 to get together and there will be some big pockets out against Nominet.

But maybe you are right and the business owners will just say "oh, all right then".
Perhaps Bill Gates will just say - "oh well, we don't really need hotmail.uk - our customers will understand Nominet's vision".

It will be interesting to see how it all unfolds.

 

[Retired_Member38]

I've asked more than once - yet nobody has been able to post a single, actual valid legal basis that they're going to take legal action on.

Its all just *crying* "unfair! blah blah blah".

So for anyone contemplating legal action... lets see what you're going to base it on then.

 

[Retired_Member38]

Just a few examples are here:
http://www.notagreatplacetobe.org.uk/victims/
There are many many others..

If there are many others, why aren't they listed? Is it perhaps because they're not actually a big issue, and people couldn't care less about them?

If anything, such a short list of 'losers' is helping the 'for' argument. In reality there is going to be very few problems.

Putting Facebook.org.uk on that list is ridiculous. How exactly are they a 'victim'. They have a 2nd rate domain extension, and they will still have one when the dust settles. They really are losing nothing from this launch.

 

[Edwin]

I wouldn't even think about the lawsuits angle - thats just people on a forum blowing hot air. When push comes to shove... none of them are going to do it as they have absolutely no legal basis for it and the bills from it would be crippling.

What makes you think any legal action would come from domainers?

Once the definitive, final "launch mechanism" is published (assuming that Nominet were to go ahead with .uk) that will also allow the "exceptions" to come to the fore including large companies that will lose "their" .uk to .org.uk owners, for example. And many of those are likely to have lawyers on staff - so why wouldn't they go for legal action.

We can argue for a billion years about whether they are right or wrong to feel entitled to the UK, but it is likely that at least some percentage of those .co.uk holders who will miss out will A) feel entitled* AND B) have the resources to take legal action

*rightly or wrongly. Doesn't matter which. We're only talking about outcomes here, not about the thought processes behind them. Logic is not a necessary precursor to lawsuits.

 

[Edwin]

If there are many others, why aren't they listed? Is it perhaps because they're not actually a big issue, and people couldn't care less about them?

If anything, such a short list of 'losers' is helping the 'for' argument. In reality there is going to be very few problems.

Putting Facebook.org.uk on that list is ridiculous. How exactly are they a 'victim'. They have a 2nd rate domain extension, and they will still have one when the dust settles. They really are losing nothing from this launch.

Could it be because the final "mechanism" for determining who is a "winner" and a "loser" is still open to doubt? Until Nominet put a definitive algorithm out there and say: "this IS how .uk WILL be allocated" what's the point of trying to find thousands of exceptions? Everything could change on that front once their final decision to go ahead is published.

Once it's a concrete reality and no longer an abstract idea i.e. once it goes from proposal to implementation, that's where the bulk of real-world entities are likely to sit up and take notice.

 

[AssetDomains]

When do you think the outcome will be released it was the following day with v1 wasn't it. Hope they don't go to long into november

 

[Edwin]

When do you think the outcome will be released it was the following day with v1 wasn't it. Hope they don't go to long into november

I imagine it will take a lot longer unless they rubber-stamp V2 without changing anything at all.

For example, if they decide to scrap it they will need to come up with a "justification" for scrapping it, which could take their PR team some time.

If they decide to go ahead but in a revised form, those revisions will need to be fed back from the Board meeting and to the policy team (or other teams impacted).

There are (broadly) 4 possible outcomes that I can see
A) .uk doesn't go ahead
B) .uk goes ahead as per V2
C) .uk goes ahead in a different form, but without a further consultation i.e. Nominet use their initiative to modify V2 and call that the final version which they then impose on the industry
D) .uk moves to a V3 consultation

I would love an early indication of the outcome of the Board meeting, but I just don't think it's realistic to expect one!

 

[Retired_Member38]

And many of those are likely to have lawyers on staff - so why wouldn't they go for legal action.

Because legal action that has absolutely no legal merit, will lead to you paying costs of the other side.

Could it be because the final "mechanism" for determining who is a "winner" and a "loser" is still open to doubt? Until Nominet put a definitive algorithm out there and say: "this IS how .uk WILL be allocated" what's the point of trying to find thousands of exceptions? Everything could change on that front once their final decision to go ahead is published.

The site in question's sole purpose is to derail the launch of .uk. So it makes sense to lead with their best examples of why v2 sucks. Its absolutely pointless pulling better examples out of the hat if/when v2 is confirmed next month surely.

So lets take a look at the 'biggest' losers they can come up with:


Ocean.co.uk - domain doesn't even resolve. And the winning domain is listed on sedo... if you want it go buy it.
Hotmail.co.uk - domain redirects elsewhere. Not exactly a big loss.
Windows.co.uk - domain redirects elsewhere. Not exactly a big loss.
Dreams.co.uk - commercial company. Winning domain owned by a domainer... therefore easily purchasable & not a disaster.
Food.co.uk - nobody cares. Undeveloped .co.uk, owned by an investor. Tough luck for them.
Independent.co.uk - this is a bad result, no argument there.
CQC.org.uk - extension suits the use here. If this is one your best 'bad results', there isn't much to see here.
Sky.co.uk - Sky use .com anyway. .uk appears to be easily purchasable, so no real issue here.
Facebook.org.uk - Ridiculous inclusion. Its a secondary domain extension... the less of type ins to Facebook is going to be zero. Clutching at straws with this.
GAP.co.uk - major corporation on one side, charity on the other. Easy to see how this pans out... a nice fat donation and Gap get the .uk
EE.co.uk - This should not be on the list!!! ee.ltd & ee.co.uk are the same company.
Unwins.co.uk - company that sells seeds. Hardly a major loss. .co.uk redirects to eBay anyway so purchasable?
Adams.co.uk - other domain unused. Purchasable?
Art.co.uk - just some random art company, no big loss in general. .org.uk unused anyway.
Planet.co.uk - another one that appears to be a commercial org on one side, and a purchasable domain on the other.
Oba.co.uk - domain redirects elsewhere. Not exactly a big loss.
Moo.co.uk - Minor printing company, who use .com anyway. Not a big loss.
Ico.org.uk - extension suits site. Plus .co.uk is for sale - if its a problem, go buy it.


3 stupid inclusions marked in red... one bad result marked in green. For the rest... who really cares?

 

[Rob_F]

When do you think the outcome will be released it was the following day with v1 wasn't it. Hope they don't go to long into november

---
Registration of second level domain names

We would like to thank everyone who took the time to read the proposals and respond. We have received 313 consultation responses, as well as feedback from four roundtable sessions, stakeholder meetings, emails and a webinar.

The feedback will be reviewed by our Board at their next meeting on 29th October. Once a decision has been reached on the way forward, we will publish submissions, where permission has been given to do so, and an assessment of the impact of the current proposal. We expect to publish our update in early November.
---

I would expect within the first week of November, based on the above email.

- Rob

 

[Stephen]

Post from Nominet forum

From Nominet forum today;

Board meeting today
Appreciate many of you will be keen for news from our Board meeting today discussing the review of registrar agreement and second level registrations.

However, whatever the outcome of these discussions, there will be further work required to think though next steps.

This will take some time and therefore we will be publishing the outcome in due course.
__________________
Phil Spray, Nominet.

So no further forward.