Competition - what does it take to compete with the masters?

[gordi555]

Hi guys and girls,

I've just finished my first script to try and catch some names. I've got everything working at maximum allowance etc.

My question: What is a competitive time to seeing a domain as available until the point that Nominet has the register command please?

I'm not looking for any trade secrets here, just want to know what I'm up against please

Thanks all!

 

[namestrands]

impossible to answer as no-one shares times so how could you gauge what is competitive.

There are so many variables to be honest, but aside of speed, luck certainly plays a big role.

 

[Aaron Clifford]

As long as you send the registration request via first class post you should stand a chance . As said above no one will share to much with you. I guess the way to gauge success is if the names you catch you sell and make money on.

 

[namestrands]

Will share a snippet, and perhaps a lesson that many of you learned.

You have to research your host, and a shared host or VPS server located outside of london really will not cut it.

If you really want to compete with the big boys then consider LONAP or LINX membership along with a 1GBE connection directly into a router that peers with NOMINET.

Your Script can be faster than everyone elses, however unless you have the low latency connection to run it on then dare I say its pointless.

Many I have seen have tried and failed, you simply have to fail at least another 10 or so times, while wasting a few grand in the process in order to find a level where you can be happy with.

Even after all that, you still need a bit of luck.

I have spent to date on my trials around £3-4k and I am on my 6th server... time and investment are essential to success.

But saying that, there are those who do not play by the rules and pool resources so effectively have 1.3m dac connections (giving 900 lookups per minute)

 

[Retired_member41]

Surely you can work it out, if its just the time from when you received the available command to nominet getting registration request, it will be the time you have to nominet from your server plus the very short time your script takes to send it 2-4 ms? I'm sure the more seasoned catchers can tell you more.

I was shown a script recently which to be honest was beyond me a little, but having listened to my partner and some other catchers enough to make your ears bleed, I was surprised that he was sending his create request from a new frame opened to the epp after he received the domain available. Everyone else laughed at this, but it just shows you that people do things differently.

He now of course has an open epp connection waiting for the domain available result and cant believe he missed something so simple, open epp's, open emails, 1 character left down the pipe, if only nominet would release all the tips, which ones are nonsense and which ones work, god knows lol

Where do you host? That must be a big factor?

 

[namestrands]

Without a stick to gauge it by it would simply be guess work.

The best way to learn is to make mistakes, the same is true in life as it is in dropcatching, there will be trips and falls along the way but once you figure it out its all worth it.

Learning from others teaches you their mistakes.. To truly master something you can only learn from your own.

 

[Retired_member41]

wow namestrands replied miles before me, his post wasnt there when I started, must remember not to unload dishwasher in between writing a post

1.3m dac quota noooo, is that all.

If you have the where with all, connections and funds, you could poll over 5 1/2 million per 24 hours just using 1 tag

 

[namestrands]

Not sure how you could do that considering the DAC limits and AVOIDANCE clause.

 

[Retired_member41]

You mentioned 1.3m by cheating and I just said that even from 1 tag registering all the names, you could have over 5 and a half million dac requests a day, obviously cheating the rules that is.

Say your after 1 name you could have 4 servers polling at 1000 a minute each, and just after 7 hours when it runs out, simply add the new 4 servers to the dac and epp, do this again and you could poll for 22 hours equating to 5186000 with two hours to spare, ok so possible just under 5 and a half million lol

As long as you have the means then you can poll as often as you wish using multiple nominet accounts, just have to make sure the figures add up in catches, and I would guess you would need to be one of the best to even make it close to paying, imagine having an oridinary script and spending the family silver on servers and nominet accounts for your family and friends, pets and relatives deceased even and not catching much lol

 

[gordi555]

Thanks for the great responses all, giving me a better picture and shown me a few paths to take!

 

[Aaron Clifford]

Just keep trying things speed isn't everything...I've caught a LLL.co.uk with four names loaded polling at 200ms before so effectively polling the name once every 800ms. There is more luck than you can imagine!

 

[namestrands]

You cant have 4 servers polling on the same tag each doing 1000 queries per minute. You would get blocked within 20 seconds.

Remember its 432,000 per rolling 24 hours PER TAG regardless if you have 1 server or 1000 servers.

You mentioned 1.3m by cheating and I just said that even from 1 tag registering all the names, you could have over 5 and a half million dac requests a day, obviously cheating the rules that is.

Say your after 1 name you could have 4 servers polling at 1000 a minute each, and just after 7 hours when it runs out, simply add the new 4 servers to the dac and epp, do this again and you could poll for 22 hours equating to 5186000 with two hours to spare, ok so possible just under 5 and a half million lol

 

[Edwin]

The point being made was to use multiple Nominet accounts (against their rules, I know - I believe Caz was talking very much "theoretically") synched to blast out polling requests at different times of the day (to dramatically increase the rate) but with the actual registration requests (as opposed to the DAC lookups to see if the domains are available) piped through a single tag holder.

For example, with 24 "separate" tags in the mix, each working for an hour, the controlling entity behind the setup would have 24x the chance of a single tag holder of scoring any given domain. Of course they'd have to not get caught at it, but when the stakes are high you never know what people may try...

 

[namestrands]

its a challenging process, but one worthy of the time and effort to learn. Cheats aside its somewhat of a lottery at times luck plays a truly big role.

 

[Retired_member41]

Edwin is correct it was using multiple accounts. However. Name strands your mistaken as the tag Your using doesn't make a blind bit of difference. The 5 and a half million was using 14 nominet accounts and the dac access from those accounts. Adding 4 ips to your epp and changing them. Hang on I've explained above.

Nominet do not track a tags dac requests. It's just an accounts requests. The reason I limited it to 5 and a half million was if your using the 1 tag to register your domains. You just change the epp ips times 4 3 times a day and then at 10pm twice

As Edwin said. Possible but if someone was going to use all those accounts they may aswell use the other tags.

Unless of course you had done a deal to monitor nominet members domains and get the odd catch for them in return for using their dac. After all lots of nominet members not using dacs. Well not by themselves anyway lol

 

[namestrands]

The Inference I made with the "per TAG" comment was meant per Account or TAG owner assuming the owner was honest. Regardless its a redundant process considering it is against Nominets rules and is entirely in bad faith.

No system is infallible and most are open to abuse. Regardless I stand by that its an exciting thing to learn, even when making mistakes.

 

[Retired_member41]

I wasn't having a go by the way lol

Yes learning is exciting.

But if anyone wants to pm me the answers straight away feel free

 

[davedevelopment]

To the OP, lots of people have shared times, try searching and you'll find posts like this

http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/domai...learnt-whilst-building-drop-catch-system.html

 

[gordi555]

Thanks for the link Dave. I came across that before and was useful. I take it his times are in seconds though and not ms?

I have an example of my times for catching...

2011-11-08 18:19:29.8368140: DAC RETURN: scarper.co.uk,Y,N,2003-08-08,2011-08-08,123-REG

2011-11-08 18:19:30.0425410: DAC RETURN: microinvestment.co.uk,N

2011-11-08 18:19:30.0427210: ###REGISTER: COMMAND SENT TO NOMINET FOR DOMAIN
2011-11-08 18:19:30.4599130: ####CAUGHT: microinvestment.co.uk ####
2011-11-08 18:19:30.4828980: #### TRIED TO CATCH: microinvestment.co.uk ####

The response from Nominet is REALLY slow - is this normal?

Thanks.

 

[namestrands]

I would expect to see average:
DAC SEND
DAC RECIEVE
to be around 4000µs (0.004s)