Sharing internet (router setup)

[woopwoop]

I have relatives in the apartment below. They've asked to share our internet.

I'm concerned about:
1. Loss of speed (I have 75up/down) might not be an issue
2. Security - access to IP cams, NAS and other devices on my network
3. Their kids clicking downloading viruses, clicking on google ads that later result in my accounts getting tied up (due to being on the same IP)
4. Suggested ads/privacy - my Google searches/web history leading to them seeing ads for Russian brides (lol - I'm happily married, not to a Russian bride)

Does anyone know if there are any other issues to be concerned with and also is there a way to set up the router that separates all traffic and devices on each network?

 

[Adam H]

Its been a good 10 years or so since ive been in the IT game but I'd probably just buy another router/access point which routes from your main router, you then give the apartment below the secondary routers wireless key and if setup correctly should isolate your local network and the secondary on the same line.

But as you outline there are other precautions to consider, Biggest concerns for sharing a network and the very same reason I wouldnt logon to a public network or open zone would be;

The guys sharing your internet are more savvy than they make out, they use a handy little tool called Cain and Abel and ARP poison your traffic (very easily a monkey could work it out) which would give them way more access than you currently consider to be bad. Such as take all your logins, monitor everything you do online with out you knowing..............almost like a keylogger on a machine but worse.

I personally wouldnt let anyone on my network, not even a nice old lady down the road.

 

[monaghan]

If sharing, then I'd setup 2 completely isolated subnets, take a single Internet router and assign 2 separate sub networks with no routing between them. Take a look at something like the MikroTik routerboards, quite cheap, but hugely powerful, this would be your Internet gateway and then hang 2 separate wireless access points one on each physical network, (if correctly configured) this will stop them from accessing your network.

The issues of your common shared IP and the impact to this is a different issue, does your ISP offer multiple static IP addresses? If so you could route your traffic on one and their traffic on another. I can't really think of any other solution to this issue.

 

[spiderspider]

Tell them to stop being cheap skates and pay for their own broadband, like you do with yours.

No problems that way

Otherwise, I would agree with Adam and set up an additional access point.

 

[diablo]

How much does it cost for internet access where you live?!

PS It's bad enough your own kids complaining every time the internet goes - imagine what it will be like with the family downstairs!

 

[zehrila]

I am sharing my router with 2 other people, its been years, no issue, they are not very tech savvy anyway, plus I prefer to trust people and they mostly turn out to be good.

Since I have been in your situation, I feel you are being bit paranoid, I did have a bit of similar concerns, but nothing ever went wrong. If there are going to be several people using your internet then speed might be an issue at times, but you won't find too much of difference.

If you decide to share your internet, just set some guideline with them in friendly manner, you don't really need to tell them about your websites, there should not be an issue with your adsense either, I have lived with several people over several years and never had any issues with adsense.

I would say, as long as they are not really crooked, dodgy tech savy kind of people, it should be okay, otherwise you can politely ask them to arrange a separate broadband connection.

 

[monaghan]

Since I have been in your situation, I feel you are being bit paranoid, I did have a bit of similar concerns, but nothing ever went wrong. If there are going to be several people using your internet then speed might be an issue at times, but you won't find too much of difference.

The main issue is non technical people as they tend to be the ones that end up downloading the malware that then starts trying to find other hosts on the same subnet to infect. I'd always put something you don't control on a standalone network.

 

[PoshTiger]

You don't need to bother setting up 2 subnets - just buy a wifi router that has a guest wifi - mine does, a TPLink Archer VR900.

You setup your own wifi as now, but you can also setup a guest SSID which isolates each connecting computer.

It does mean that computers on the guest SSID can't talk to each other but that's not really your problem..

 

[woopwoop]

Great info here!

Maybe I am paranoid but I've been in situations where I should have been more so. My motto now is plan for chaos and try and anticipate and control as much as possible.

Downstairs want me to feed them a cable so a guest wifi network won't work. They're hooking up their TV (they already share our Netflix and Hulu accounts!) and their Wii U and desktops, they'll probably be creating their own wifi network through their router.

Part of me really wants to say no, but it's a tough spot and when our apartment (elsewhere) was flooded last year, they put us up for 3 weeks (until we moved into the apartment above them) and they wouldn't take any payment for it. I want to help them save money if I can too as long as it doesn't impact my network.

I do have an extra router somewhere so I guess I just have to create a separate network that I feed from my main router (I guess this router should have DHCP disabled, because they'll have a router downstairs with DHCP enabled, distributing IPs to their devices... Is that correct?).

Thanks for the advice.

 

[monaghan]

Many routers will let you create additional subnets, so create an additional subnet such as 192.168.10.X and assign that to downstairs.

I'd put your spare router between the main router and your subnet so the main router simply NAT's both of the subnets and doesn't route between them, this will give minimal risk of accidental or intentional traffic between the 2 families.

If they are hooking up to their TV though, this may pull lots of data whilst streaming HD TV which could impact your service (depending on whether your ISP is oversold or does any traffic shaping - the rate you get between the router and the exchange doesn't mean you'll get that same speed out of the ISP's network!)

If you already have a spare router and a sufficiently long cable, then there's no outlay other than a bit of time to configure it all to give it a try and see if it works for you.

 

[woopwoop]

I should know more about this stuff, and some of it is coming back to me. In a 13 years ago I was installing BT Openzone wifi hotspots at sporting events!

Also I have a couple of Hikvision IP cams linked to my Synology NAS and I just got it running properly today.

It seems everytime I start a networking project I have to learn a huge chunk again...

Thanks for the advice.

 

[pberry4032]

Most routers will have client separation option you can enable so they can't contact other devices on the network.

I wouldn't use two routers as you need to know what you're doing for this and this is normally done on larger corporate networks.


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[monaghan]

I wouldn't use two routers as you need to know what you're doing for this and this is normally done on larger corporate networks.

It's not that difficult if you treat the 1st router as a simple NAT device with no wifi, you may need to tweak a few settings if you want inbound ports for CCTV and such like open, but no more difficult with multiple routers than a single router and it can't be a bad thing to learn a little about security can it?

 

[spiderspider]

Downstairs want me to feed them a cable ......

You also say you're in apartments, so presume either rented, or owned on leasehold (very few apartments are freehold, due to the nature of apartments).

I would guess that somewhere within the leasehold agreement there is something about creating holes between properties, and you'll need the FH permission to do so. If rented, then the landlord would need permission of the freeholder. You'll be damaging the fabric of the building if drilling between properties, and most free holders wouldn't allow such things.

There are also fire issues to consider, and even risers should have fire blocks in place.

Running the cable outside window to window may also create issues, and won't be good for the cable.

If you're after a get out clause, that's the one I would use Unless they're property experts, in which case they'll know a way round it.

 

[woopwoop]

If you're after a get out clause, that's the one I would use Unless they're property experts, in which case they'll know a way round it.

I like your thinking but it's not going to work. The guy installs CCTV systems for a living, I already have IP cams mounted outside and there's a clear path to get the cable downstairs. The type of building is a two family home 2 entrances but effectively a big house split into two.

When I get chance, maybe next weekend, I'll give the subnets a shot on a short cable before I send the full one downstairs.

Does anyone know if software like wakeonlan for mac will find all devices that are accessible on the network so I can see if the config separates the network?


On a slightly different note for anyone interested, I had so much trouble recently getting 'surveillance station' (Synology's IP cam software) to work on Mac but after doing long overdue OS updates and a Safari Java install it is awesome.

The quality on the IP cams (Hikvision DS-2CD2032-I 12mm and 3mm bullets) is amazing, and Synology's software sets up target zones for motion and there's a timeline view where I can quickly get to and see events.

I'll attach the cameras and POE switch I bought it's all feeding a DS1513+. Am finally getting more use out of the NAS.