The Death Of Web Designers..

[julian]

After seeing the new WiX advert rolled out on TV today one has to wonder.

The market its potentially hurting is the question I get asked every other day..

"Hello I want a website, but don't want to spend very much.."

"I just want a simple website - 4 or 5 pages, that's it..how much?"


"My mates grandson just left uni and he can do them for £75.. how much?"


</beatheadagainstwall>

 

[Retired_Member38]

I think a lot of people would struggle to justify a full custom design over paying someone for 1-3 hours to modify a very nice WP theme. None of their site visitors are going to realise that it isn't a fully custom design once the logo etc is changed anyway.

When I see people paying under £500 for a really horrid custom design I just think wtf are you doing... get yourself a great off the shelf design and a £20 logo and you would look a million times better...

 

[retired_member34]

After seeing the new WiX advert rolled out on TV today one has to wonder.

The market its potentially hurting is the question I get asked every other day..

"Hello I want a website, but don't want to spend very much.."
"I just want a simple website - 4 or 5 pages, that's it..how much?"
"My mates grandson just left uni and he can do them for £75.. how much?"

</beatheadagainstwall>

There wasn't really a market there in the first place was there? Lots of small businesses just don't see any value in their website. It provides an outlet for all the "websites should be free, or next to free" types. If they ask you such a question, just point them towards wix. You don't want a customer that doesn't want to spend any money.

I think it will kill off the "web designers" that don't know a damn thing about design. Every town had one, they were normally a small IT or computer service company that fell in to web development because some of their customers asked them for one. Their sites look like crap but they don't know this.

I think a lot of people would struggle to justify a full custom design over paying someone for 1-3 hours to modify a very nice WP theme. None of their site visitors are going to realise that it isn't a fully custom design once the logo etc is changed anyway.

When I see people paying under £500 for a really horrid custom design I just think wtf are you doing... get yourself a great off the shelf design and a £20 logo and you would look a million times better...

I know what you mean, but unless the business owner is savvy enough to find a good Phillipino designer, or similar, and maintain the site themselves then it is hard for them to accomplish this. I wouldn't be interested in supporting a company that only has a budget of £100, but still wants someone to hold their hand when their site is compromised, WP needs updating and this breaks the theme, or they screw it up in WP, or they forget their password. Why would I? I certainly can't get a plumber to help me fix my leaky tap myself over the phone.

I was never interested in the £500 market, as you say £500 just didn't buy enough hours to get a decent looking design. However frameworks/libraries such as Bootstrap and Jquery have changed that to a certain extent.

As an aside, there is a local restaurant that had a small fortune spent on it. I'm talking a custom rolled stainless steel bar, custom made tables and wood platters. A great logo, professionally designed, and the same graphic designer to produce new menus every few months. Custom cut vinyl graphics for their window each holiday, the list goes on - there was no expense spared in getting everything to look just right. Their web solution? A Wix site on a .uk.com domain.

 

[Edwin]

There are huge numbers of local businesses which don't need to change their websites very often/at all - all they need is a clean, simple, professional looking mini site - effectively the online equivalent of a brochure or leaflet - that explains who they are, what they do, where to find them, what time their business is open, etc.

For every business that needs to do ecommerce, there are probably 50 (500?) that don't.

For every business that needs to update a site frequently, there are probably 50 (500?) that don't.

How much do a plumber, an electrician, a cleaning service etc. really need to keep updating some all singing, all dancing website?

So there's room at the top end for any amount of expertise to build big, bold, interactive sites - but little local businesses (nothing derogatory intended by that expression, btw!) don't need such fancy stuff, not by a long shot.

 

[denchomsky]

The question is do they rank anywhere in the SERPS for their business/Search terms?

Although some business's just need a page on a domain for reference, other are others competing with other business's, localy and countrwide for customers, this is when a template that is almost identical to 10,000 other websites will fail, as it usually will not be flexible enough to optimise to be able to compete with something more bespoke.

 

[retired_member34]

How much do a plumber, an electrician, a cleaning service etc. really need to keep updating some all singing, all dancing website?

They don't in theory, hence Wix. Then in a couple of years they'll lose their access so will put up another free website on another system. Both of them will have different phone numbers than the yell site they paid for a few years ago. None will match the listing details on Google +, which has changed the backend every 9 months so they have no idea how to update it.

At all levels things can be done well, or badly.

 

[boxfish]

This is a business card that local tradesmen dropped through my door just over a year or so ago. The email address perfectly highlights their view of having a legit email address and paying £500 for a website.

 

[Retired_Member38]

The question is do they rank anywhere in the SERPS for their business/Search terms?

Although some business's just need a page on a domain for reference, other are others competing with other business's, localy and countrwide for customers, this is when a template that is almost identical to 10,000 other websites will fail, as it usually will not be flexible enough to optimise to be able to compete with something more bespoke.

Spoken like a true web designer :lol:

It doesn't matter if a template is similar to 10,000 others - if the content itself is unique then it is completely irrelevant.

You are going to be able to find a flexible enough Wordpress theme for a small business 99%+ of the time. And they're going to get far more bang for their buck going down this route with a custom logo, than hiring you to do a custom job.

A Woothemes site with a custom logo is going to look way more professional than anything you can churn out for £1000 and its going to be significantly cheaper too. Would you agree with that?

 

[denchomsky]

Spoken like a true web designer :lol:

It doesn't matter if a template is similar to 10,000 others - if the content itself is unique then it is completely irrelevant.

You are going to be able to find a flexible enough Wordpress theme for a small business 99%+ of the time. And they're going to get far more bang for their buck going down this route with a custom logo, than hiring you to do a custom job.

A Woothemes site with a custom logo is going to look way more professional than anything you can churn out for £1000 and its going to be significantly cheaper too. Would you agree with that?

To a certain extent, yes I would agree with you, but most people wouldn't know what to do with a Wordpress theme or HTML website template once they purchased it, it doesn't just turn itself into a website, so they would probably need to hire a dev or someone with some dev experience anyway.

I will also give you an example of why I said what I said originaly, it was not just because I am a web dev/designer.

A local florist where I live is losing loads of business to another florists based hundreds of miles away, the local florist is on a Florist shopfront type CMS website, that loads of other florists use, they just 'change the logo and add some content' , the other florist has there own website.

The other florist has cleverly created hundreds of other pages targeting all area's of the UK and optimsed their keywords, alt tags, titles, the URL's are also nice and freindly.

I took a look at the local florist CMS and you can hardly edit anything, you cant add alt tags, you cant add custom text to category pages, the URL's are all rubish numeric meaningless URL's, you cant create custom content.

This is the issue with alot of these DIY template sites, a savvy SEO aware company from outside your area can easily outrank your site, I see this as an issue don't you?

 

[Retired_Member38]

If you can't be bothered creating content or promoting it, then it shouldn't be a surprise when a florist from the next town over starts stealing all your business.

But that isn't really related to the design issue - you could pay £5000 for a brilliant looking website, not add any real content to it, and suffer the exact same fate.

From an SEO point of view, this for $75 florist template would work just as well as any completely custom design - http://www.templatemonster.com/wordpress-themes/44583.html

 

[denchomsky]

If you can't be bothered creating content or promoting it, then it shouldn't be a surprise when a florist from the next town over starts stealing all your business.

But that isn't really related to the design issue - you could pay £5000 for a brilliant looking website, not add any real content to it, and suffer the exact same fate.

From an SEO point of view, this for $75 florist template would work just as well as any completely custom design - http://www.templatemonster.com/wordpress-themes/44583.html

Well yeah obviously, but thats not what I said?

I said there were no means to add content where content was needed, which is not the same as not being bothered to add content and promote it?...you seem to be constructing replies to suit your arguement.

And as for the template, again I re-iterate, give that template to someone who knows nothing about development or wordpress and they wont be able to turn it into a website, so they will be $75 down.

 

[Retired_Member38]

And as for the template, again I re-iterate, give that template to someone who knows nothing about development or wordpress and they wont be able to turn it into a website, so they will be $75 down.

Or if they give it to someone who knows how to install WP and can manipulate a logo in psd they'll probably pay them $50 = $125 total. And be at least $875 up.

 

[denchomsky]

Or if they give it to someone who knows how to install WP and can manipulate a logo in psd they'll probably pay them $50 = $125 total. And be at least $875 up.

Fine, yeah that simplified scenario conveniently suits your arguement except that once built the client doesnt know how to add sidebars, have a different heading banner for each page, add and adapt plugins, deal with spam, create a search results page for just one category......

 

[retired_member34]

Or if they give it to someone who knows how to install WP and can manipulate a logo in psd they'll probably pay them $50 = $125 total. And be at least $875 up.

Where do they find this skilled person who is willing to do the initial work for $125, and then support them on an ongoing basis?

You can find them. I can find them. They can't. You could probably do the work yourself. I can do the work myself, but I'm certainly not going to do it for a customer for minimum wage.

 

[Edwin]

To a certain extent, yes I would agree with you, but most people wouldn't know what to do with a Wordpress theme or HTML website template once they purchased it, it doesn't just turn itself into a website, so they would probably need to hire a dev or someone with some dev experience anyway.

Most small business owners don't need "web development" they just need a simple, clean-looking site that conveys the essential information about their business in a polished, professional way. Most web design firms either don't understand this or deliberately ignore it.

Sure, there are thousands of businesses that have ecommerce needs, but there are hundreds of times as many that don't - and many of those are underaddressed by the typical web design/development service.

Remember, you don't have to have a template that nobody else is using if you're a 'local' business - you just have to have one that no other business in the same area and niche as you is using.

For instance, if you're a plumber in Dover it shouldn't matter one jot if a plumber in Aberdeen, or in Whitby or in Faversham has started with exactly the same "plumber template" and a couple of hours of simple customisation (by that, I don't mean "coding" but a bit of tweaking of colours, perhaps column widths, and a custom logo, plus sticking the basic content in) since there is no way that those other businesses can be considered "competitors" to your own.

But you probably would care if you're the third plumber in Dover to have the exact same template-based website, because then you (all) look like cheapskates!

For most small businesses, any discussion that includes the words "content management system" or "programming" or "database" or "development" or "custom *" (where "*" is anything other than a logo) is going to be super-duper-overkill for what they need.

 

[mat]

You seem to be quite the expert on what people need, yet the majority of your websites, if not all look like they were made in 1997.

 

[Edwin]

You seem to be quite the expert on what people need, yet the majority of your websites, if not all look like they were made in 1997.

That's because they were, by me

Last time I updated the design of one of them in any major way was probably 7 or 8 years ago (I don't call fiddling with a domain sales lander 'major')

 

[mat]

I find it really refreshing when I see "local businesses" put a lot of time, effort and money into a proper website and marketing, that really sets them apart from the other local competition. I have seen it work wonders for many small businesses.

That does not mean they have to spend the earth building it up though.

 

[mat]

That's because they were, by me

Last time I updated the design of one of them in any major way was probably 7 or 8 years ago (I don't call fiddling with a domain sales lander 'major')

and that is great, but you are probably missing out on hundreds of opportunities because of it, but each to their own

 

[Edwin]

and that is great, but you are probably missing out on hundreds of opportunities because of it, but each to their own

I doubt it, I don't sell anything on any of the sites (apart from domain names) - there are no customers.