Why Nominet Has Got It Wrong About The Royal Mail And Bad Actors

[diablo]

Anyway, I've said all I'll say about this. I don't expect you - or anyone else - to take my word for it, which is why I keep saying "Google it"!

Rather than Google it, I've asked Nominet directly.

I'll let you know their response.

 

[invincible]

This is important for those who work from home legally, but whose tenancy agreement forbids the use of the address for business (I find myself in this position and so do tens of thousands of others). A PO Box means I can continue to trade while not having to trust my post to anyone other than the Royal Mail. I shouldn't have to go to additional expense or trust my post to anyone else.

Why shouldn't you have to go to additional expense or trust your post to anyone else? If Royal Mail decided to increase the cost of renting a PO Box beyond what you could comfortably afford, you'd need to find an alternative solution. Things can and do change. Stating that you feel you shouldn't have to do something is your prerogative but nobody is requiring you register a .uk 2LD. A solution might be keeping the majority of your post at the PO Box and having an address for service entity for those .uk 2LD registrations you wish to make.


(from iPhone)

 

[diablo]

Why shouldn't you have to go to additional expense or trust your post to anyone else? If Royal Mail decided to increase the cost of renting a PO Box beyond what you could comfortably afford, you'd need to find an alternative solution. Things can and do change. Stating that you feel you shouldn't have to do something is your prerogative but nobody is requiring you register a .uk 2LD. A solution might be keeping the majority of your post at the PO Box and having an address for service entity for those .uk 2LD registrations you wish to make.
(from iPhone)

Nothing that you say above justifies me going to extra expense or indeed trusting my post to anyone other than the Royal Mail.

Nominet made great play of not wanting to add extra expense to UK businesses during the consultation process - and yet this does exactly that.

Your solution of using a mail forwarding service just for 2LD registrations however is a good one and one I may have to pursue.

 

[diablo]

Anyway, I've said all I'll say about this. I don't expect you - or anyone else - to take my word for it, which is why I keep saying "Google it"!

I asked Nominet directly if the reason for excluding PO Boxes was, as you suggest, because of the need for an address for service and the reply I received was:

"An Address for Service is only required where a registrant address is not within the UK."

 

[RobM]

Typical nominet response.
Translation: 'We failed to understand your question or decided you wouldn't like the answer - please accept this cookie-cutter response that in no way leaves you any the wiser'

 

[Edwin]

I asked Nominet directly if the reason for excluding PO Boxes was, as you suggest, because of the need for an address for service and the reply I received was:

"An Address for Service is only required where a registrant address is not within the UK."

That's cut-and-paste reworded from the FAQ. I'd suggest that it's a non-answer, as has already been indicated, and thus worthless.

 

[invincible]

Nothing that you say above justifies me going to extra expense or indeed trusting my post to anyone other than the Royal Mail.

How do you take delivery of anything that is sent via a courier, requires a signature, and not using Royal Mail?

Nominet made great play of not wanting to add extra expense to UK businesses during the consultation process - and yet this does exactly that.

You'll have to direct us to where they did that because, for one thing, every new .uk 2LD is an extra expense although not a mandatory one. Nominet also anticipated that companies would have new stationery and new signs printed during the normal course of business, but any entity switching to a new .uk 2LD prior to their stock of stationery depleting completely or before their signs needed reprinting would obviously incur additional expense.

Nominet always stipulated that a UK address would be a requirement and that PO Boxes were not suitable. It probably wouldn't be against the rules of your tenancy to put the address where you reside in the WHOIS but I presume you don't want people visiting you unannounced.

Your solution of using a mail forwarding service just for 2LD registrations however is a good one and one I may have to pursue.

I don't see any other solution.

 

[diablo]

How do you take delivery of anything that is sent via a courier, requires a signature, and not using Royal Mail?

You'll have to direct us to where they did that because, for one thing, every new .uk 2LD is an extra expense although not a mandatory one. Nominet also anticipated that companies would have new stationery and new signs printed during the normal course of business, but any entity switching to a new .uk 2LD prior to their stock of stationery depleting completely or before their signs needed reprinting would obviously incur additional expense.

Nominet always stipulated that a UK address would be a requirement and that PO Boxes were not suitable. It probably wouldn't be against the rules of your tenancy to put the address where you reside in the WHOIS but I presume you don't want people visiting you unannounced.

I don't see any other solution.

I know you like to be pedantic, but the fact is I'm overseas a great deal - that means post being held for me while I'm away and I trust Royal Mail to do that more than I would a private mailing service.

Nominet have put a policy in place which I am questioning. I've yet to receive any satisfactory answer.

And it is against my tenancy agreement to use my address for business purposes, although not to work from home.

 

[diablo]

That's cut-and-paste reworded from the FAQ. I'd suggest that it's a non-answer, as has already been indicated, and thus worthless.

Nominet haven't been able to give a satisfactory answer to any of the questions raised concerning PO Boxes.

 

[invincible]

I know you like to be pedantic, but the fact is I'm overseas a great deal - that means post being held for me while I'm away and I trust Royal Mail to do that more than I would a private mailing service.

How do you take delivery of anything that is sent via a courier, requires a signature, and doesn't come using Royal Mail?

Nominet have put a policy in place which I am questioning. I've yet to receive any satisfactory answer.

And it is against my tenancy agreement to use my address for business purposes, although not to work from home.

I'm not sure using the address for the WHOIS would qualify as a breach as all you would be doing is receiving post. Running a business where you met customers and employed staff would more than likely breach the agreement.

 

[diablo]

I'm not sure using the address for the WHOIS would qualify as a breach as all you would be doing is receiving post. Running a business where you met customers and employed staff would more than likely breach the agreement.

You're not sure because you simply don't know, but you obviously think you know better. In this case you don't. I am not allowed to use the address for any business purpose.

 

[invincible]

You're not sure because you simply don't know, but you obviously think you know better. In this case you don't. I am not allowed to use the address for any business purpose.

I think there's always a possibility of misinterpretation of a legal document but clearly I couldn't possibly know for sure because I haven't read your tenancy agreement and therefore I wouldn't presume until I had. It depends what constitutes "use for business purposes".

How do you take delivery of anything that is sent via a courier, requires a signature, and doesn't come using Royal Mail? Do you not order anything online, for business use, that is only deliverable by a courier? If you do where does it get delivered to?

 

[diablo]

I think there's always a possibility of misinterpretation of a legal document but clearly I couldn't possibly know for sure because I haven't read your tenancy agreement and therefore I wouldn't presume until I had. It depends what constitutes "use for business purposes".

How do you take delivery of anything that is sent via a courier, requires a signature, and doesn't come using Royal Mail? Do you not order anything online, for business use, that is only deliverable by a courier? If you do where does it get delivered to?

Don't you have a hot water tap that needs running?

 

[invincible]

Don't you have a hot water tap that needs running?

My boiling one? The Quooker? I am considering having a cup of tea as it happens. If you were to order any business supplies online of a reasonable value the chances are you'd need to sign for them because they would be sent via a courier. I don't believe couriers deliver to PO Boxes. You haven't answered this question after three opportunities so either you don't order any business supplies (e.g. a new computer, consumables, potentially anything billed to your business) online or you do and those orders might "accidentally" be couriered to your home address. If it were the latter I'd find it hard to distinguish between that and using the address in the WHOIS. Of course I realise only you truly know what you do.

 

[diablo]

My boiling one? The Quooker? I am considering having a cup of tea as it happens. If you were to order any business supplies online of a reasonable value the chances are you'd need to sign for them because they would be sent via a courier. I don't believe couriers deliver to PO Boxes. You haven't answered this question after three opportunities so either you don't order any business supplies (e.g. a new computer, consumables, potentially anything billed to your business) online or you do and those orders might "accidentally" be couriered to your home address. If it were the latter I'd find it hard to distinguish between that and using the address in the WHOIS. Of course I realise only you truly know what you do.

Even when you are told you are wrong, you find it difficult to accept it and so try to think of a way you might be right after all. I don't think you truly do know that only I know what I do. Deep down you probably think you know better ;-)

I actually get very little business-related delivered to my home, but there is a big difference between a courier delivering a parcel from Amazon once in a blue moon and the address appearing on 5,000+ whois notices, including for domains that attract up to 50,000 plus unique visitors a month.