.UK Announced

[markb]

MarkB - its a disgrace that nominet should suggest .org.uk and .me.uk be given an equal footing (or an advantage if they have used their domain and you haven't) with a .co.uk domain. With one hand they set out suggested uses for .co.uk, .org.uk and .me.uk - and then they say that all of them have equal right to a domain for businesses. Crazy.

I own a couple of .org.uk domains where the corresponding .co.uk domains are probably valued at 5 or 6 figures. I dont however think I should have a right to bid against the owners of the .co.uk domains, even though the .co.uk domains arent being used. Obviously though if the auctions went ahead as proposed I would make sure I won them, whatever it cost me.

 

[websaway]

I own a couple of .org.uk domains where the corresponding .co.uk domains are probably valued at 5 or 6 figures. I dont however think I should have a right to bid against the owners of the .co.uk domains, even though the .co.uk domains arent being used. Obviously though if the auctions went ahead as proposed I would make sure I won them, whatever it cost me.

What a ludicrous situation a co.uk owner of a £100,000 domain forced to pay an enormous amount for the right to what he virtually already owns, bidding against someone who is willing to bid any amount to beat him.

No wonder Nominet designed it so.

 

[Paullas]

What a ludicrous situation a co.uk owner of a £100,000 domain forced to pay an enormous amount for the right to what he virtually already owns, bidding against someone who is willing to bid any amount to beat him.

No wonder Nominet designed it so.

Also how do you know people wont be bidding just to push more money for the nominet trust? not saying it will/does happen but you never know.

 

[markb]

What a ludicrous situation a co.uk owner of a £100,000 domain forced to pay an enormous amount for the right to what he virtually already owns, bidding against someone who is willing to bid any amount to beat him.

No wonder Nominet designed it so.

Its stupid but its what will happen. From nominets point of view its not a £100,000 domain, it initially cost whatever nominet sold it for. Maybe nominet wasnt happy that the domains are now being sold for thousands out of their control. Now they can bring out .uk replacement domains, and make people bid potentionally tens of thousands for single domain names, and they can take the profits themselves this time around. Its a great idea for nominet and will bring in hundreds of millions for them. The only losers are the business and domain owners forced to bid and pay thousands again for what they already own and have bought before.

 

[Stephen]

Rewriting History!

I see Andrew Bennett is reporting that the chair of the Nominet's .uk Policy Stakeholder Committee James Panton has resigned ? Along with his deputy Mike Galvin?

Not communicated to members, the reasons are not known. Nor was Dave Thomas's appointment to the committee. Dave wrote in the guardian this week about it.... we didn't know he did so in the capacity of his new post.

Do you have a link or any more information on these resignations please.

Dave Thomas is head of UK at Sedo and member of the Nominet stakeholder committee was mentioned at the bottom of The Guardian article and it looked strange that he was trying to rewrite history from nominet's point of view at the time with:

Rather than arbitrary making changes Nominet has sought to enter into a consultation process. To kick it off Nominet has outlined its thoughts in a proposal to stimulate the debate about achieving a more trusted country level domain.

The proposals are a starting point for the debate

 

[GreyWing]

Nominet forum mate, yep you are right it does say on that article that he is a member. I assumed that was a member of Nominet, didn't know he was now on the committee.

Would be interesting to know why they resigned.

 

[Paullas]

How can another staff member of sedo be on the nominet board (no matter what board it is)? Wasnt nominet also frightened last year of domainers taking over nominet when sedo is the biggest 'domainer' in the UK.

Also was this position advertised, and if so where. I am gobsmacked at hearing this and totally believe nominet have lost the plot.

 

[Stephen]

Nominet AGM

...Also was this position advertised, and if so where. I am gobsmacked at hearing this and totally believe nominet have lost the plot.

It is going to be a very interesting Nominet AGM this year, they may need to find a bigger venue.

handling of .uk, .wales, Stakeholder committee doing what?, new expiring policy, IDN for UK namespace next item​

I can see a vote of no confidence coming, if the bulk of UK registrars can be contacted!

 

[Stephen]

2011?

I see Andrew Bennett is reporting that the chair of the Nominet's .uk Policy Stakeholder Committee James Panton has resigned ? Along with his deputy Mike Galvin?

Not communicated to members, the reasons are not known. Nor was Dave Thomas's appointment to the committee. Dave wrote in the guardian this week about it.... we didn't know he did so in the capacity of his new post.

Maybe a red herring as according to Linkedin he resigned in 2011 but cannot access old Nominet website to see if there were any details on that.

As is normal cannot find any news on the subject on the new Nominet website.

 

[GreyWing]

Could well be mate, although I'm 99.9% sure Dave Thomas is a new arrival, spoke to him 2 months back and never mentioned anything about his place on this group.

 

[TinkyWinky]

Hi Nigel

Excellent...

It may make some sense for a few of us to also send a very similar email to Ms Bradley and keep her busy when she returns from what will probably not be her best Xmas ever!

Can we not also make reference to their ridiculous claim that they would be done for "spam" if they sent that email? Is that right - sorry can't find where someone said they had said that...

If anyone has the facts on that... that is incredibly powerful!

For starters it means their legal team have no idea what they are talking about with regards to the laws on "spam" - as well as everyone of the 10million domain holoders being customers, this is also a change to the UK domain space that existing domain holders woudl need to know about!!! They have also contradicted themselves in the meeting where they first say they can't, then propose to email all domain holoders in the next breath!

Secondly, a great line to leak to the Press to show the confusion in Nom towers...

TW

Hi Everyone - haven't been on here for a while. Just to say that Edwin, Stephen and the rest of you deserve a medal for all your efforts. Thought I'd let you know that I have emailed Eleanor Bradley at Nominet over their decision to not even send an email to their existing customers. Whatever your views on direct.uk it is scandalous that many existing customers have no knowledge that this consultation is going on. All the best. Nigel. Here is the email. I'll let you know if, and when, any reply is received.

Dear Ms Bradley

I have watched your video in respect of the proposed introduction of direct.uk. Our company opposes the introduction of this new extension and we have already submitted our feedback. We were very fortunate to hear about the launch of your consultation on 1st October 2012 because we visited a forum where a member had kindly posted details. We know, for certain, that many .co.uk domain registrants still have no idea that this consultation is taking place and I am writing this email to you on their behalf.

In your video you say that you are “really keen to hear feedback” and that you are “going out and speaking to stakeholders and engaging with those people who would be impacted by this change…”. These comments are completely at odds with your decision to not send an email to your millions of existing customers. You know that owners of .co.uk domains are the group most likely to be ‘impacted’ by this change, yet you have deliberately decided, to keep them in the dark about direct.uk. It would have been a fairly simple task for you to email these customers - they certainly deserve to know - and I am sure many would have provided the feedback you say you are looking for. I understand that some of your meetings were very poorly attended and one was cancelled (as only one person responded) which is not surprising if you didn’t invite existing registrants. Please note that I am not using this email to discuss the details of direct.uk but simply for an answer to these three questions:

Who made the decision to not send an email about direct.uk to your existing customers?

Why did you not email your existing customers about direct.uk?

Please provide attendances for the meetings that took place around the country to discuss direct.uk?

I would be grateful if you could provide these three answers urgently. The deadline of 7th January is very close and I am anxious to do all I can for the nominet customers who will be impacted by this change, and who are currently unaware that this consultation is taking place. Thank you.
Yours sincerely

 

[Edwin]

Even if they had spam concerns, they could easily email only those entities that have declared themselves ("Registrant type") to be something other than individuals (i.e. "UK Limited Company", etc.) as the rules are more relaxed about emailing corporate entities rather than people. Even that would still result in several million people knowing about the issue rather than a few thousand.

 

[Stephen]

The real reason

Even if they had spam concerns, they could easily email only those entities that have declared themselves ("Registrant type") to be something other than individuals (i.e. "UK Limited Company", etc.) as the rules are more relaxed about emailing corporate entities rather than people. Even that would still result in several million people knowing about the issue rather than a few thousand.

Although it was stated to me and many people the "spam" email excuse by Nominet and a confusion on what the answer should be when they actually launched .uk, as their excuse about spam would also apply to the launch?.

I think the real reason was included in the recent Guardian article by Phil Kingsland at Nominet:

As we have proposed that any new service would be an addition to the .uk namespace, rather than a transition, this led us away from automatically 'grandfathering' every existing domain to the owner of the .co.uk domain.

As .uk is completely new and the .co.uk would still be going on, it would not effect them and so no need to contact them, sorted!

 

[markb]

As .uk is completely new and the .co.uk would still be going on, it would not effect them and so no need to contact them, sorted!

Thats the main argument I can see against the proposal. How can the .uk be a completely new product when it is aimed at businesses? It therefore will eventually replace the .co.uk

Also if one of the main aims of the new .uk domains is security, then why let the .co.uk domains carry on and not be secure? People would therefore start to not trust the existing .co.uk domains even if they are secure and trust the .uk domains more forcing companies to switch over.

The whole proposal is ridiculous and full of holes.

 

[retired_member27]

Everyone has biases - that's human nature - but some are just more obvious about it than others!

I can't believe you actually said that as you are one of the most biased people on this forum with your 7000 domains.

If you discount the very few domainers here who are up in arms about the direct.uk proposal there is actually very little noise out in the real world against the idea.

Good post Sound btw quoting the Guardian comment.

 

[markb]

I can't believe you actually said that as you are one of the most biased people on this forum with your 7000 domains.

If you discount the very few domainers here who are up in arms about the direct.uk proposal there is actually very little noise out in the real world against the idea.

Good post Sound btw quoting the Guardian comment.

I have to reply to this one as i'm not a domainer but one of the few business owners that actually are aware of the proposal.

As far as im aware nominet has only mainly informed domainers about the proposal and not the actual business owners and people in the real world. Thats why its mainly domainers complaining at the moment. If all business owners where aware of the situation, they would be definately complaining.

Nominets proposal will actually benefit domainers in my eyes and will only hurt business owners. At the end of the day its mainly domainers that would be aware of the .uk release, and domainers have scripts that can automatically register all the best domains in seconds when they are eventually released to the public, and will then be trying to sell the domains to their corresponding .co.uk business owners for a profit.

 

[Stephen]

Noise?

I ...If you discount the very few domainers here who are up in arms about the direct.uk proposal there is actually very little noise out in the real world against the idea.....

Where are all the media stories about how good the .uk would be for the UK economy,
how many new jobs would be created and how cybercrime would be
dealt a massive blow by the new .uk security?

There simply isn't any such stories as they would not be true.

The noise has come from those againist it and although everybody has self-interest,
some loook at the big picture and consider other people.

I believe an informed comment would say for .uk there has not been enough transparency, a skewd process,
not enough debate, not enough research, no alternative solutions have been aired
and not enough people being aware of .uk proposal for it to be introduced.

 

[retired_member27]

I do agree that Nominet should contact all .uk domain owners and trademark holders as a matter of course as well as announce it in the national press.

The problem I have is the domainers on this forum who think that they should automatically get grandfather rights over trademark holders and businesses, and also the sheer self interests that are on display here, as I've said before if the people who are making the most noise didn't own any domains they wouldn't care less about the direct.uk proposal.

Do you actually think Nominet cares what domainers have to say anyway, as far as they are concerned domainers are right at the bottom of the ladder.

 

[foz]

Do you actually think Nominet cares what domainers have to say anyway, as far as they are concerned domainers are right at the bottom of the ladder.

Probably not, but they did scoop up most of the short domains when auctioned off. We dislike you and what you do, but your money will do nicely. So they are at the top of the ladder when buying.

Direct.uk will only benefit Nominet, Registrars, Cybersquatters, Solicitors (disputes) & Domainers. It's businesses at the end, the so called stakeholders, that will be feeling this one in the pocket (lost leads and/or outlay to acquire).

 

[Stephen]

What outcome?

....Do you actually think Nominet cares what domainers have to say anyway, as far as they are concerned domainers are right at the bottom of the ladder.

If domainers did not challenge the nominet .uk proposal and make some noise
then it is my strong believe the Nominet proposal would have gone through as is.

But not because the proposal being right but because nobody looked at the proposal critically.

Then going through as is, can anybody honestly say that speculators, domain investors,
cyber squatters and cybercriminals due to their knowledge and resources would not obtain at least 50% of the premium new .uk domains,
then their domain experiences are not the same as mine!

Then consider looking at the UK namepsace after this happens and the unintentional consequences that will surely come.