20i Domains

New domain expiry process and droplists for .uk

Discussion in 'Nominet Tag Holders' started by webber, Jun 14, 2022.

  1. webber

    webber Active Member

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    It's finally happening...

    Just in case you haven't received the email from Nominet:
    https://registrars.nominet.uk/uk-na...rocess-and-introduction-of-drop-lists-for-uk/

    Testbed release: 2022-06-14
    Production and OT&E release: 2022-09-13


    Domains will:
    • no longer drop at random times.
    • drop at a specified time published in a daily drop list; the drop list will contain domains which have not been renewed from the point of suspension for non-renewal.
    • become available for re-registration by any registrar through the existing Web Domain Manager and EPP systems.
    Drop Lists
    At the time of the production release, drop lists will go live and be available publicly for anyone to download over HTTPS.
    We will update the drop list daily, and the format will include:
    • ROID (Repository Object Identifier)
    • Domain
    • Drop time in UTC
    More info here: https://www.acorndomains.co.uk/threads/drop-lists-implementation-working-group-roundtable.173103/

    Registration Data Access Protocol (RDAP) server for .uk
    RDAP is the modern computer parseable protocol defined within the IETF to offer a secure data-rich replacement for the insecure plain text-based WHOIS protocol historically used by domain registries.
    In time for the launch of expiring domains changes, we will formally launch an RDAP server for the .UK registry. This new service will include a richer data set not shown on WHOIS, such as domain status information.
    Read more here: https://www.acorndomains.co.uk/threads/nominet-uk-rdap.173119/

    Web WHOIS for .uk will be replaced with a new lookup service utilising RDAP data
    We will replace our Web WHOIS client for .uk with a modern user focussed RDAP client designed to not only provide the data currently offered by web WHOIS but also provide helpful information to internet users regarding what the particular data returned means.
    You can already find a similar client at webber.biz/rdap
     
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  2. Domain Forum

    Acorn Domains Elite Member

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    articles.co.uk
     
  3. Robert Smith United Kingdom

    Robert Smith Active Member

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    What impact will this have on the drop domain market?

    All domains drop at the same time 00:00 everyday?
     
  4. webber

    webber Active Member

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    No, each domain will drop at a specific time.
    RDAP and Web Whois will soon display that time and it should be the same time that the domain was registered.

    Impossible to say at this stage. The goals are to reduce the need for fake tags and make the entire thing simpler and more transparent.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
  5. Robert Smith United Kingdom

    Robert Smith Active Member

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    Ok - interesting to see how it plays out.
     
  6. Ben Thomas

    Ben Thomas Well-Known Member

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    Interesting. Nobody but the best will get a look in on the domains. Surely it will be "fastest gun in the west" situation?
     
  7. webber

    webber Active Member

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    I don't think so, not necessarily.
    If your route is stable enough and you can compensate for the latency, then you should have the same chances as anyone else.
     
  8. boxerdog

    boxerdog Well-Known Member

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    A great day for multi tag holders.
     
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    Last edited: Jun 14, 2022
  9. diablo

    diablo Well-Known Member

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    How will it reduce fake Tags?
     
  10. webber

    webber Active Member

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    Indirectly, of course. The reason people created fake memberships/tags using friends, employees or business partners, was so that they would increase their DAC allowance.
    Since the DAC will no longer be useful for dropcatching, the need for these fake tags is removed.
     
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  11. diablo

    diablo Well-Known Member

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    But if this system is fairer and all Tag holders have roughly equal chance of getting a name, surely the more Tags you have....
     
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  12. Aaron Clifford

    Aaron Clifford Well-Known Member

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    The race is on to find the new EPP exploit. ;)
     
  13. webber

    webber Active Member

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    Yes and no. You will be able to officially request an additional tag if you think it will help (you can do this today), but no need to create a fake membership for the additional DAC
    We already had EPP exploits. One was so effective that for a period of months nobody was able to catch anything meaningful except for the exploiter (I think that's the one Barbara briefly talked about in her webinar)
     
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  14. JamesTuplin Germany

    JamesTuplin Active Member

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    Im sorry, how on earth this can be seen as a positive step is beyond me. It is a disgrace. Where was the member consultation or final vote on this?

    It very much feels like 'this is happening if you like it or not!'.

    Publishing the exact drop time, brings even greater competition and even more reasons to collude. The same people with multiple tags also have multiple memberships. They would now have multiple create requests. Send 10 create requests at time of deletion or 100 staggered create requests starting 1/2 a second before (split between tags). Who wins? Answers on a postcard please.

    The 'issue' never was the impact on Nominet systems as more server resources could have been added or a window of time in which domains drop, the issue was always tag (membership) collusion and Nominets inability or slowness to act when overwhelming evidence is provided. Perhaps if more time and resources had been spent here instead of ruining it for the vast majority that do play by the rules?.

    "The reason people created fake memberships/tags using friends, employees or business partners, was so that they would increase their DAC allowance."

    Yes they now have more create requests and they know the EXACT time the domain drops.
     
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  15. JamesTuplin Germany

    JamesTuplin Active Member

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    The last webinar on this was Thursday, December 02, 2021!

    Unless someone else can enlighten me to any other occasion where we have had a vote on this?
     
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  16. JamesTuplin Germany

    JamesTuplin Active Member

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    Even looking here on Acorn. Nothing.
     
  17. Paullas

    Paullas Moderator Staff Member

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    I agree with James on this Old Nominet new faces.

    Can someone explain and point me to the documentation on how Nominet are going to police this. I never seen a members vote around this unless i missed it and if that's the case i will take it back but to yet again push it through without members vote is still back to Nominets old ways.

    Also by doing this does Nominet knows exactly who is family members, friends and pets and what tags are being used working together?
     
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  18. Pedigree United Kingdom

    Pedigree Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure how it will stop fake TAGS as surely they will still want the extra EPP requests?

    I would also be interested to know if users with multiple TAGS will be restricted to just one of there TAGS having access to the EPP. If not, there is surely a massive benefit in having 3 TAGS as 3 times the chance of success - unless I am understanding things incorrectly?
     
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  19. wizard

    wizard Well-Known Member

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    This is a joke won’t change anything and seems like your happy about it @webber this makes it much harder and I’m sure most people agree this won’t work !


    QUOTE="webber, post: 654406, member: 17035"]It's finally happening...
     
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  20. webber

    webber Active Member

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    James, you are right in that this was a Nominet proposal, but members were able to submit their feedback and Nominet has made some changes based on UKRAC and wider membership feedback.
    You know very well this was subject to a consultation via the UKRAC and a roundtable open to all members. You took part in the roundtable and submitted questions.
    Feedback was accepted by email as well.
    Email reminders were sent by Nominet to members requesting their feedback on the proposal and I have personally reached out to some of the dropcatchers I know to ask their thoughts. I expressed my disappointment as to how little engagement there was from the members at the time.

    Since then this went through a UKRAC and Board vote which took some time because meetings take place every 6 weeks or so. Following Board approval the product team worked at implementing this, which is all within the expected timeline.
     
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  21. Paullas

    Paullas Moderator Staff Member

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    @webber so have you seen or heard anything on how Nominet are going to police it? They have obviously decided its going ahead the way they want it so surly they must have done the checks on WHEN not If people abuse it they know who is doing what?

    And what will happen to the Multitags are caught? will the domains be taken back and re release or will it be you got it so you can keep it.
     
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