This is NOT good...

[expertc]

From the BBC site (hey, no black hat here!).

P.S. I have PhD in quantum physics

 

[Blossom]

I have no idea what you mean.

 

[WigWam]

i think he is on about http://www.v3.co.uk/v3-uk/security-...hat-seo-attacks-spotted-japan-earthquake-lure

 

[expertc]

Take no notice. It's usual for this section of the forum; post a headline which requires everyone reading to click it to find out WTF the poster is referring to, then a single URL link without any analysis, opinion or addition from the poster. Also all totally irrelevant to the actual theme of this forum.

It might be irrelevant to the forum, but it might become relevant to all. If... I don't even want to think about ifs... The latest 'if' was in 1986...

BTW we also have a thread on Japan here...

 

[aZooZa]

I'll take a wild and reckless stab in the dark as to what expertc was posting.

a) He was making a point in the GENERAL forum that the situation in Japan in terms of the nuclear disaster is bleak.

b) He was joking that his link was indeed genuine, and duly went to the site that was indicated. Hence the 'black hat' rider.

c) He suggests that the science is complicated and probably more easily understood by someone with a relevant doctorate. Maybe has has one; maybe not. So what?

Where's the harm in that? Looks like the police are out again tonight in force.

 

[expertc]

I'll take a wild and reckless stab in the dark as to what expertc was posting.

a) He was making a point in the GENERAL forum that the situation in Japan in terms of the nuclear disaster is bleak.

b) He was joking that his link was indeed genuine, and duly went to the site that was indicated. Hence the 'black hat' rider.

c) He suggests that the science is complicated and probably more easily understood by someone with a relevant doctorate. Maybe has has one; maybe not. So what?

Where's the harm in that? Looks like the police are out again tonight in force.

@aZooZa Thanks for explaining few things. I posted it just before I went out. I simply wanted people to have a look at the article and I think I owe some explanations. You can also reed more here.

1. If reactor goes into meltdown it might cuase second Chernobyl.
2. Sea water is very corrosive and reactors are not made to use it as a coolant.
3. One of the reactors uses plutonium-rich fuel which is not good at all in this situation

This is why I think this info is relevant to everyone.

P.S. I've mentioned my degree in physics simply to show that I know what I am talking about

 

[tifosi]

From my understanding, once the emergency protocols of cooling the core are enacted (boric acid & sea water) then the reactor can never be used to generate power again.

Considering they generate 20%+ of Japans power (fukushima & the one a bit farther north) that's going to have a massive impact on japan's economy. Beyong the immediate effect is the economic long term effect on Japans GDP both in immediate cost and rebuilding, but also long term on industrial efficiency & productivity.

As Japan is a primary economy this WILL have an effect on the global recovery from recession.

Not seen any reports about it yet, but give it time.

S

 

[expertc]

From my understanding, once the emergency protocols of cooling the core are enacted (boric acid & sea water) then the reactor can never be used to generate power again...

The problem is, the core is very hot, yes boron can slow neutrons but what is happening now is water turns into oxgen and hydrogen on cadmium rods. This creates 'hydrogen bubble' iside the reactor that pushes water down and exposing rods. Also temperature is so hot that the corrosive effect is becoming stronger.

 

[binny]

I do not have a relevant doctorate but I do believe the whole situation to be bad shit. Were this any country other than Japan I think it would be more worrying but I'm sure they are more capable than most of minimising the effects of the nuclear incident.

The whole thing is just tragic in my opinion, an absolutely tragic reminder of the frailty of human life.

 

[tifosi]

The problem is, the core is very hot, yes boron can slow neutrons but what is happening now is water turns into oxgen and hydrogen on cadmium rods. This creates 'hydrogen bubble' iside the reactor that pushes water down and exposing rods. Also temperature is so hot that the corrosive effect is becoming stronger.

Basically, for the layman, the reactors are fucked, permanantly. If they manage to keep them from going into meltdown and blowing the lid off the reactor vessel (another Chernobyl)... and that's a big IF on at least one of the 4 reactors all they'll be able to do is decomission them at the obvious cost.

On top of that it's normal for a major quake of that magnitude to have an aftershock of 1 magnitude lower than the major quake somewhere along the fault. So they're expecting a 7.9-8.1 quake on the same fault line -the tip of which which runs to Tokyo - withing the next few months. The Christchurch quake was actually an aftershock of the one a few months earlier. The reason the tsumami went in the east west direction is that the plate Japan sits on is being pulled down by the pacific plate subduction. So when the pressure was released the sea floor springs up like flicking an ink pellet from a ruler. If it happens again further south you may get a tsunami on the Tokyo area as worst case.

S

 

[expertc]

Basically, for the layman, the reactors are fucked, permanantly. If they manage to keep them from going into meltdown and blowing the lid off the reactor vessel (another Chernobyl)... and that's a big IF on at least one of the 4 reactors all they'll be able to do is decomission them at the obvious cost...

Another problem is, Japanese reactors are of BWR (boiling water reactors) type, Chernobyl was graphite type (RMBK). After the accident graphite reactors were not widely used anymore considered unsafe and replaced by BWR. If BWR blows - it might bring the end of nuclear power stations everywhere.

 

[tifosi]

getting 2 people with scientific training talking about science stuff is worse than 2 wags talkin about bling & makeup!

Jut waiting now for the religious nutters to come out of the woodwork and say it's God/Allah/Jehovas* divine justice for all the Japanese being heathens!

(*delete where appropriate)

 

[expertc]

getting 2 people with scientific training talking about science stuff is worse than 2 wags talkin about bling & makeup!...

I see your point... Just sometimes the scientific training allows to "read between the lines"... This is were the title of the post comes from...

 

[DomainManagement]

Interesting

Hi guys i would just like to say thank you for enlightening me
its really good that you talk about this kind of stuff

as education is supposed to be a en lighting thing


i do apologise in advance to the asshole in the Caribbean if any of my spelling or grammar is incorrect like i give a s*"t

 

[Bailey]

it might bring the end of nuclear power stations everywhere.

I too have a pretty good understanding of the technology and potential consequences in different type of reactors - But, with that last statement you really are taking things far into fantasyland.

And if your background is as you say then I know - that you know that already. Who was it? that said "A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing." It's forgivable for the layman to make such statements, Not so for somebody educated in the field of physics.

 

[expertc]

I too have a pretty good understanding of the technology and potential consequences in different type of reactors - But, with that last statement you really are taking things far into fantasyland.

And if your background is as you say then I know - that you know that already. Who was it? that said "A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing." It's forgivable for the layman to make such statements, Not so for somebody educated in the field of physics.

Yes, it is a strong statement. But who says that I am against it (closing the nuclear power stations)? But not at that price though. At this moment nuclear power stations are being advertised as safe. And this is where my background in physics works well for me. I don't thing they should ever be placed in densly populated areas. They depend on technology too much and technology is not 100% safe at all. Do you know that in Chernobyl they tried to lower cadmium rods manualy?! And it was 1000 roentgen there. And the technology failed. Do you know that the area needs 20,000 years to become decontaminated? Even the BWR reactors that not use flamabale graphyte are now showing as too unsafe, and currently there is no alternative to BWR?

This is my point.

P.S. I am not joking or boasting about my background in physics. I do have several papers published in Phys. Lett., Nucl. Phys., etc. Can give refs but I don't think it would be interesting or relevant to this thread.

 

[Systreg]

Microwave dinner for me

 

[expertc]

...But, with that last statement you really are taking things far into fantasyland.

"Switzerland abruptly suspended plans to build three new and replace four existing nuclear plants..." Not much fantasy... The rest is here

 

[scooter]

I think building nuclear reactors is complete madness.

I think it is triple madness to let a country that drill every month for earthquakes, build 55 of them! In all honesty, what is that about?

Yes, I know as with all things it comes down to money but what a legacy to leave future generations.

Only another 19,980 years to go before they can safely build another one at Chernobyl.



The Irish government distributed potassium iodide tablets to every household 7 years ago. This is not because they have any reactors, this is in case of an "incident" here in the UK and the wind is blowing West.

What do we do? We stockpile. :lol: (Unless you live within a mile radius of a plant. If you do and request them they will give you them. )

Let's look at this a little closer. You live 3 miles away and there is an meltdown and major escape. 30 mile an hour winds will have that little cloud round you in 6 mins. But don't panic. Its all ok, your government has it under control. They will announce on the radio and tv and they will tell you where your nearest stockpiled station is. It is kept secret for now because of fear of mass panic.

Why do we not just take Irelands lead and distribute them to every household now? Maybe its because it would then be percieved that nuclear is not as safe as they want us to think. Who knows, but hats off to the Irish government for taking the initiative in proactive safety for their population.

Please, don't tell me they are as safe as houses, it's a safe industry etc. We are looking at 3 that are going tits up as I write. They are all ticking timebombs. The french have had anti aircraft missiles stationed on the rooftops of all theirs for years.

What are we doing with all the waste at present? Are we still digging shafts to store the most toxic sludge on the planet?


.

 

[scooter]

Here's a thought. What if, on 9/11 they really took the initiative and slammed 2 jumbos into the same nuclear power plant?

.