Police want to be able to close down sites...?

[namealot]

Police want to be able to close down sites with the assistance of nominet..? There are certain sites that need closure... But why the police think that they should be judge and jury... Thought they were there to uphold the law not make it ? We already have a legal system in place to do that… More powers, Strange that you could do the same thing with a non uk site and it would be much harder for them makes a sort of mockery of it...? If it meant they could act before a conviction had been secured way out of order...
Necessity or big brother....




http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-11845961

 

[rob]

Agreed - who made them judge judy and executioner

 

[wb]

Can see people wanting to claim large amounts of damages if (when) any mistakes are made... more expense for the taxpayer.

 

[Retired_member41]

I'm pretty sure they will have enough of a case before closing a site down.

Society needs people and organisations that can make decisions quickly, there may be the occasional mistake but the benefits would outweigh these I'm sure.

And as far as the Internet is concerned much more needs to be done.

 

[GreyWing]

I'm pretty sure they will have enough of a case before closing a site down.

Society needs people and organisations that can make decisions quickly, there may be the occasional mistake but the benefits would outweigh these I'm sure.

And as far as the Internet is concerned much more needs to be done.

No it doesn't Caz, seriously if you had seem the sides of authorties that I have then you would realise why it needs correct and accountable justice.

There was a recent thread about Mason's. That took me one hell of a battle and 6 months of my life to get sorted, I'll say no more.

I'm not a bleeding heart liberal either, but the courts have to be the accountable forum for such rules.

 

[wb]

I do agree that something does need to be in place to speed up the process with SOCA.

However, even if a site should be closed down, justice should be fair and it is the same with other crimes which require a 'fair trial'. I imagine there will be many technicalities defence and compensation solicitors will be looking at to seek damages if there is even one thing which hasn't been done 100% correctly.

It will happen in the courts regularly, where cases are thrown out or found 'not guilty' due to lack of evidence. The authorities will have thought originally there was enough evidence (i.e. in this case close down a site) but the courts have found otherwise (i.e. site should not be closed down).

 

[monaghan]

I agree with Caz, with the exception that the evidence must be placed before a suitable "judge" for a provisional decision before Nominet take the site down.

You "lift" a criminal from the streets prior to the trial so have no issue in principle with shutting a site prior to a full trial, however, the decision must not be directly with the police, there must be proper accountability.

 

[namealot]

We all know banks and alike could bring in measure to combat fraud over night there’s technology there that would make it very hard already they don’t use it )It should also be up to the institutions to prevent this crime and not allow a floored system to then be used and let other foot the bill … What crimes do they think it stops the use of a uk domain that’s even questionable as they would unlikely know until the crime had been committed (By then in the vast majority of time its too late) If they did before its there are plenty of legal routes that are far more effective already that can be taken in an instant...

Whilst I understand criminal acts should not be judged buy cost alone as they could easily register 100, 1000 names I wonder how much it would cost to take each one down...
It would I suppose mean that they nom got there reg fee…. So nom happy there

What about all the other extensions…? there ok to commit crime from...

Personally thinks its censorship under the guise of crime prevention...

 

[GreyWing]

You "lift" a criminal from the streets prior to the trial so have no issue in principle with shutting a site prior to a full trial, however, the decision must not be directly with the police, there must be proper accountability.

For 24 hours, before they must be charged or released. Then you have to go to a migistrate, so within 24 hours you have accountability.

What's the due process with this, I make a complaint about you as you are my rival in google, my mate is a copper. I ask him to get your site taken down.... don't come crying to me is what I will say. Your site gets ripped out by google and you might not recover for 8-10 weeks. It could end many legitamate business.

Does it happen, yes it happens from first hand experience I know for a fact it happens.

Why not contact visa or mastercard and ask them to suspend the merchants account if it is illegal. Stop people paying these sites with their cards whilst they are investigated.

 

[monaghan]

GW - You only half quoted me - the first part of my reply did state that there should be someone external to the police to make a judgement on the facts at hand and authorise the shutdown (whether this is done via Nominet or the merchant's revenue collection account or other means).

No evidence - no shutdown, as you say anything else is open to far too much abuse.

 

[Paullas]

is there any uk laws about uk businesses running a uk business but using an address in thailand?

 

[GreyWing]

GW - You only half quoted me - the first part of my reply did state that there should be someone external to the police to make a judgement on the facts at hand and authorise the shutdown (whether this is done via Nominet or the merchant's revenue collection account or other means).

No evidence - no shutdown, as you say anything else is open to far too much abuse.

Sorry mate i might have got the wrong end of the stick, I apologies if so. from reading it I thought you meant that as long as the judge or maistrate assessed it then it was fine, which I agree with.

What I thought you meant after reading the bit I quoted is that you wanted it after the site had been taken down. I was on about before it was taken down.

But that is where my confusion may have come from

Cheers
GW

 

[crabfoot]

I think I could countenance the police taking down a site if the evidence had been presented to a stipendary magistrate, and he had signed a warrant authorising the closure, but only if the material on the site was grossly and blatantly offensive or criminal. There has to be a distinction between criminal acts and civil matters.

I would hate to see the closure powers extended to "matters of national security". On occasion, that excuse has been used to protect someone undeservedly, and on other occasions I have been left with a feeling that the people have not been presented with the full facts.

 

[GreyWing]

Just with regards to what I was saying and Police involvement in Business deals and friends of friends..

http://www.allvoices.com/contribute...officers-suspended-after-allegations-of-fraud

These suspensions are to do with business dealings, now imagine you are their competitor and you have a popular website, bye bye website.

That's why we need at least magistrate oversight before anything is taken down.

 

[newguy]

More ridiculous controls on people's lives. I dread to think what the world will be like in 30 years.

 

[aZooZa]

This operation should/does have the ability and quite rightly so:

http://www.ceop.police.uk/

I know a couple of the SB officers that have to deal with that filth and these are hardened coppers that have to have regular counselling to do their job...

Other than that, no. Due process is in order.

 

[GreyWing]

This operation should/does have the ability and quite rightly so:

http://www.ceop.police.uk/

I know a couple of the SB officers that have to deal with that filth and these are hardened coppers that have to have regular counselling to do their job...

Other than that, no. Due process is in order.

Agreed mate, that is the hardest job in the world in my opinion. To see such filth and stay professional enough to get to sentencing is amazing.