.uk transfer issue

bonusmedia · Nov 19, 2014

I've had an offer accepted for a .co.uk on Sedo, but the owner is trying to pull a fast one and they've just registered the .uk.

Thankfully I haven't paid yet.

The 'transfer specialist' did not understand this at first and referred me to Nominet but hopefully I've made myself clear and they are now contacting the seller.

It's a mid £xxxx sale so things could potentially get nasty...

tifosi · Nov 19, 2014

Sean said:
You haven't paid yet so make it clear you want both names for the price agreed and if they refuse, pull out of the deal. Why will it get nasty?

No doubt sedo will start demanding their commission...

bonusmedia · Nov 19, 2014

As far as I'm concerned the deal is done and I want my domain with .uk rights as it was offered. Since that's not possible now I want the .uk transferred.

If that doesn't happen there is a breach of contract.

foz · Nov 19, 2014

If the sales contract through Sedo doesn't specifically mention a .uk or rights to it, then this is your problem. Messy.

bonusmedia · Nov 19, 2014

Thanks - I actually have that email and I quoted it to them.

I'd like to say more but I will wait and see what the response is first.

ian · Nov 19, 2014

As far as my opinion goes, if the .co.uk had rights to the .uk at the time of the purchase, i.e. the .uk hadn't been registered, then the rights go with the .co.uk. If the seller has since registered the .uk in an attempt to retain it, then they are in breach of contract and will need to transfer it.

Retired_Member38 · Nov 19, 2014

ian-d said:
As far as my opinion goes, if the .co.uk had rights to the .uk at the time of the purchase, i.e. the .uk hadn't been registered, then the rights go with the .co.uk. If the seller has since registered the .uk in an attempt to retain it, then they are in breach of contract and will need to transfer it.

When exactly is the point of purchase ?

If its when the seller accepts the offer then its going to get extremely messy if you bid on a .co.uk with the .uk not activated yet. And the seller then registers the .uk and logs into Sedo and immediately accepts your offer.

ian · Nov 19, 2014

Monkey said:
When exactly is the point of purchase ?

If its when the seller accepts the offer then its going to get extremely messy if you bid on a .co.uk with the .uk not activated yet. And the seller then registers the .uk and logs into Sedo and immediately accepts your offer.

Well, either when the domain is put up for sale or an offer is accepted, it doesn't matter, if the .uk isn't registered at that point, rights go with the .co.uk. As a clued up buyer, it would be prudent to take a photograph/screenshot of the .uk still remaining unregistered. All very messy though I do agree.

Retired_Member42 · Nov 19, 2014

Having an offer accepted doesn't mean the .co.uk has a new owner. It's just one step of a multistep sales process. The .co.uk owner has rights to reg the .uk right up until the point the .co.uk is transferred and the registrant changed. If no deal was in place for both the .co.uk and .uk domains then the purchase was just for the .co.uk as advertised. What you think/assume or expect of the seller doesn't come into it.

ian · Nov 19, 2014

Redemption said:
Having an offer accepted doesn't mean the .co.uk has a new owner.

Unless mistaken, as I've not read the Sedo terms of use, an offer is legally binding in the same way as accepting said offer is too; therefore .uk 'rights' are carried with the .co.uk assuming not already registered. I'd suggest in a court of law, this would be accurate. Just my opinion.

Retired_Member42 · Nov 19, 2014

The offer is legally binding as far as going ahead with the purchase goes but making an offer and having it accepted does not make you the legal owner of the domain - what if you have an offer accepted and you don't pay? Are you the owner? Of course not...

My point is that yes, .co.uk have right of registration of the .uk but the seller still owns the .co.uk as far as Nominet are concerned - regardless as to what has been agreed on Sedo. From Nominets standpoint, the registrant is the owner of the domain and whoever is that registrant at that time has the rights to the .uk domain. Unless Sedo specifically have some language in their terms that states the rights to the .uk registration must be passed with the .co.uk I really don't see any legal issue.

cm1975 · Nov 19, 2014

As the person who was involved in the last time this was raise on here, I can only hope it's as easily resolved as mine!

Good luck!

archibel · Nov 19, 2014

I've been in the same position earlier this year...there is a thread if you can be bothered to find it. But basically:

SEDO T&C are silent on the .co.uk/.uk issue
Their position is you entered into a contract to buy the .co.uk only
They will threaten you to pay for the domain...not just their commission

I would threaten to walk away and hope the risk of losing £xxxx is enough to convince the seller to include it.

I would never normally advocate walking away from a contract, but SEDO are negligent in not addressing this issue sooner and your seller is taking advantage of the situation.

stellar73 · Nov 20, 2014

archibel said:
I would never normally advocate walking away from a contract, but SEDO are negligent in not addressing this issue sooner and your seller is taking advantage of the situation.

If Sedo have given advice (albeit to another member) that .uk rights should be included then I can't see how they can contradict this position now and force you to pay for "lost" commission, particularly if you specifically state you were acting on that belief.

Agree totally that they are the ones being negligent here though. For an issue that is so fundamental to their business it's ridiculous that they've not clarified their position in t&c's on their site, particularly when there's obvious logic in both the contradictory assumptions people are making. Can't expect all buyers and sellers to be legal experts!

diablo · Nov 20, 2014

Who is the seller?

bonusmedia · Nov 27, 2014

Seller is a fairly big domain investment company. They have an account here but it was only fair to give them a chance to resolve it before saying who.

Thankfully Sedo have been supportive and the seller has now confirmed .uk will be included. I'm sending payment today, hopefully this can now be wrapped up smoothly.

scooter · Nov 27, 2014

That's two times out of 3 the sleazy person/company is a member here

Nice!

.

cm1975 · Nov 28, 2014

I don't know if I'm being blinkered in my opinion, as I have had a similar experience, but is there any reason for registering the .UK domain after selling the .CO.UK other than to keep it?

There is a cost of registering the .UK domain, so I see no reason why the seller would want to incur this.

If the .UK domain is transferred, then the buyer would incur the renewal costs of the .UK domain, which they would not necessarily wish until the 5 year period has expired.

Would be interesting to hear who the seller was.

bonusmedia · Dec 1, 2014

Both domains now transferred.

Thanks to Sedo who were actually helpful for once - although they really need to get this clarified in their terms ASAP.