C of E

[retired_member6]

I won't go into the marriage thoughts I've been having, I'll just ask as have been thinking for a few months and only recently wanted an answer, what happens if the C of E collapses, the archbishop is useless and the Queen hasn't said anything that I know of... do I just ignore I'm c of e, be ye olde christened and just get on with my life and forget it all?

If everyone christened without any true religious upbringing is anything like me, the church is about to lose millions of namesakes. A shame as I like the idea of a church wedding, maybe it's still possible without all the religion. But married by a government employee seems a bit off putting (however in Romania you get married twice, first at registry, then at church), this being married stuff by someone is only new anyway from what I've read, a family member would be more fitting, take it out of government and religious hands.

So yes, I guess the quandry was to do with marriage, was always going to be a few questions when the time came to think about it. I can see why people say it's just a bit of paper, me and the gf could just get married on our own with no witnesses and no decrees in law if really wanted to, if that's what mattered to us, as that's all that matters, us.

So what happens if C of E ceases to exist after 500 years? I guess my christening becomes irrelevent or I get offered the chance to be catholic, can't see many doing that in England with our history so most will probably give it all up, talk about a lost generation or three, we've just followed France I think.

 

[retired_member6]

This made me laugh

"It is just clever marketing," an unhappy Church of England vicar told me last week. "Next thing, Benedict will be tempting Eastern Orthodox Christians by offering them pews if they join the Catholics." (Orthodox services traditionally require often elderly congregations to remain standing for a full 90 minutes.)

It's true, you have to stand two hours for a wedding.

Peter Stanford: After 500 years, has the Pope outfoxed the Archbishop? - Commentators, Opinion - The Independent

It makes you wonder if the Popes action, rather than grow his numbers... will actually speed up the demise of religion in favour of science and independent thinking and natural morals.

 

[The Ferryman]

Lee, you raise very deep moral and religious questions, and I think I probably speak for many on this board who would like you to know that quandary has two "a"s



Bruce

 

[retired_member32]

i don't think the Church of England will be in existence within 20 years,i think the majority of so called c of e followers only go to church for weddings and funerals.

And with mass migration to this country from non Anglican countries it will only be time before questions will be asked and not forgetting church attendances are dwindling at a considerable rate.

 

[jasman]

Wasn't the C of E only set up so wife-murdering maniac Henry VIII could get a divorce? And ever since, each monarch despite leading an extravagent billionaire lifestyle has been the official head of the religion! This seems very far removed from the example Jesus set. Whether you believe in God or not I'm not convinced that this religion has a legitimate basis.

 

[retired_member6]

Wasn't the C of E only set up so wife-murdering maniac Henry VIII could get a divorce? And ever since, each monarch despite leading an extravagent billionaire lifestyle has been the official head of the religion! This seems very far removed from the example Jesus set. Whether you believe in God or not I'm not convinced that this religion has a legitimate basis.

No, there were other reasons although whether a pretence who knows. I wouldn't christen my children, although the gf might, it throws up cases where the child when of an age to understand, doesn't know what it means or why they did it at the time. I wouldn't have this question to make if wasn't under any religion.

Religion has no place on this planet anymore, human beings are on the cusp of a more scientific age, where most can control their own morals and each other and don't have to be fooled into believing theres a god to keep society together.

 

[retired_member32]

my missus goes church every week and she is the youngest by a good forty years,that brings problems because the church are aware the younger generation are staying away and they try to include her in every decision they make,she organizes all the events and she rallies the younger generation into turning up.

 

[retired_member12]

Religion has no place on this planet anymore, human beings are on the cusp of a more scientific age, where most can control their own morals and each other and don't have to be fooled into believing theres a god to keep society together.

Try telling that to someone who has lost a child Lee. You'll be able to imagine that pain when your kids come along, it's every parents nightmare. Religion is broader than you think when you realise you need it.

 

[retired_member6]

Try telling that to someone who has lost a child Lee. You'll be able to imagine that pain when your kids come along, it's every parents nightmare. Religion is broader than you think when you realise you need it.

Humans are preprogrammed for religion, no one knows why, didn't say no one didn't need that escape or out reach.

 

[crabfoot]

Loooky - the Church of England recognises the acts of other churches, and so do the Roman Catholics - except for the bits about women priests and divorce.

Well, they accept most of the mainstream, Methodist, Baptist, United Reformed (not the Moonies or the Mormons). The priests all go to the same theological colleges (near you in Brum, mostly) then go off to be ordained catholics or presbyterians or whatever.

If you are used to C of E services, the Roman Catholic services are almost the same - cross out "Pope" and insert "Queen", and you are in the same place.

It only gets to be a hassle if you want to marry in a church after a divorce, and you need to go to a United Reformed minister, like wot Princess Anne did.

C of E will recognise a RC marriage. The only hassle will be when the RC priest asks if you will bring your kids up as RC. Don't say "I want them to make up their own minds", say "I have no objections, we are all Christians".

My cousin gave me that advice after he said "I want them to make up their own minds when they're old enough to judge". He had to move to another parish and start again with another RC priest.

But don't convert, or you're in the same company as Tony Blair and Malcolm Muggeridge - and Bob Dylan.

The thing is, if she is RC, it makes life a lot easier for her if you marry as RC. The major UK churches don't have any problem with that, but marry in anything but a RC church and you are into grief attending the RC church afterwards.

And be careful about that Civil Ceremony. That's how Hindus do it in GB, mainly, but I was told by a (C of E) Minister a long time back that he could "not marry a couple who were already married", only bless the union. IF that's how they do it in Romania, do it there!

 

[Nigel]

Big subject Lee. Good to hear that you've found the woman you love and want to spend the rest of your life with. Marriage is a serious matter and at the end of the day, your vow is a vow, in the eyes of God, whatever church or registry office you decide to marry in.

You've touched upon the role of the C of E, which, I agree, is in terrible decline. As with all churches there are good and bad C of E churches. The 39 articles of the C of E are basically sound and our country's break with Rome did, to a great extent, bring freedom of worship and blessing to our nation - but remember that the Pilgrim fathers sought sanctuary in the New World because they were being terribly persecuted in 'protestant' england for their purer faith. The RC church hasn't changed a lot (although its outward appearance may appear softer) - they still believe in purgatory, transubstantion (the belief that the wafer and wine literally turns into the body and blood of Christ during the mass), prayer to the saints (the Bible says Jesus is the only mediator between man and God - and prayer to the dead is repugnant to God), the infallability of the Pope, the immaculate conception, idols, images, relics, confessions, the priesthood, beautification, exaltation of Mary, good works (i.e. that good works helps earn salvation), salvation in the RC church alone, etc, etc, etc. These doctrines are all completely opposite to Scripture and most were denounced in the 39 articles.

But most churches today (inc RC and C of E) no longer teach the need to be 'born again' which Jesus said was essential. Infant baptism cannot bring salvation. We all have sinned and unless we recognise this (babies can't) and repent then we cannot be 'born again'. At the point of true repentance we are 'born again' i.e the slate is wiped completely cleaned of all our sins by Jesus's sacrifice, and we start our lives afresh indwellt by the Holy Spirit, and assured of eternity in heaven.