.UK Announced

[Stephen]

I know. I was one of the 11. It was the Policy Advisory Board BTW and not the Nominet Board.

Would it be possible to provide a link to the original proposal and provide any comments made at the time please?

 

[Hazel Pegg]

Would it be possible to provide a link to the original proposal and provide any comments made at the time please?

I don't have a copy of any of that. I used to refer to the Nominet website but for some odd reason they have removed all that archived info.

 

[Edwin]

Would it be possible to provide a link to the original proposal and provide any comments made at the time please?

Original proposal: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3257_dotukrevisited.pdf (if anyone's following the debate on the Nominet Forum you'll find it came from a very familiar name)

PAB meeting that references it: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3255_PAB_meeting_Jan_05.pdf

 

[Stephen]

Old .uk proposal

Original proposal: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3257_dotukrevisited.pdf (if anyone's following the debate on the Nominet Forum you'll find it came from a very familiar name)

PAB meeting that references it: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3255_PAB_meeting_Jan_05.pdf

Thanks very much for the link, still reading this facinating insight, I was struck by the following so far ;

It brings an opportunity to have a retrospective “sunrise period” to right many wrongs that have occurred over the long and unstructured development of the .UK domain space.

I didn't see that in the new proposal but have seen lots of posts on this thread questioning Nominet motives, I can see why now!

But if that's one of their reasons bring it out in the open and let's see if all the issues have not been sorted out in the last 8 years of uk evolution!

The cost to the customer of this sunrise will depend on the costs of trademark verification, but the process used could be similar to that proposed for .eu, and indeed the successful application for a .eu name under their sunrise period might be sufficient evidence for a UK company to successfully apply.

Well if they ever use this again, say goodbye to lots of keyword domains, to several huge non uk companies!

Rgds
Stephen

 

[Stephen]

Stephen Dyer

Original proposal: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3257_dotukrevisited.pdf (if anyone's following the debate on the Nominet Forum you'll find it came from a very familiar name)

PAB meeting that references it: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3255_PAB_meeting_Jan_05.pdf

Can anybody here please contact Stephen Dyer who compiled the report on 1st October 2004, to find his views on the current proposal?

 

[Edwin]

Can anybody here please contact Stephen Dyer who compiled the report on 1st October 2004, to find his views on the current proposal?

He's still as gung-ho about it as ever. He's weighed in on the discussion on the Nominet Forum a large number of times in the last 5 weeks, basically without wavering from his initial (2004) position that this is a great way to "right wrongs".

(If anyone who has access to the Nominet Forum thinks I'm mischaracterising his position in any way, please speak up as that was not my intent).

 

[Hazel Pegg]

Can anybody here please contact Stephen Dyer who compiled the report on 1st October 2004, to find his views on the current proposal?

Steve's recent posts to the Nominet members mail-list indicate that he is broadly in favour of opening up .uk but doesn't necessarily see a need to couple that with the 'security' stuff. He also says that he rewrote his 2004 paper in 2009, but I haven't seen a copy of that.

 

[Hazel Pegg]

(If anyone who has access to the Nominet Forum thinks I'm mischaracterising his position in any way, please speak up as that was not my intent).

Seems a fair assessment to me. Remember that we are talking about the Steve Dyer who founded CentralNic and launched .uk.com on an unsuspecting world.

 

[Stephen]

Acorn v Nominet?

He's still as gung-ho about it as ever. He's weighed in on the discussion on the Nominet Forum a large number of times in the last 5 weeks, basically without wavering from his initial (2004) position that this is a great way to "right wrongs".

(If anyone who has access to the Nominet Forum thinks I'm mischaracterising his position in any way, please speak up as that was not my intent).

Thanks for that I have just signed up to use the Nominet forum as a TAG holder.

Which is going to be best to post on Acorn or Nominet, to get a real debate and insight into the issues?

 

[Hazel Pegg]

Which is going to be best to post on Acorn or Nominet, to get a real debate and insight into the issues?

Nominet. Acorn is mainly a self-selected group of people who are primarily involved in the secondary market. The opening up of .uk affects more than just players in the secondary market and the Nominet forum is read by people who won't be reading the discussions here.

 

[Stephen]

.uk.com?

Seems a fair assessment to me. Remember that we are talking about the Steve Dyer who founded CentralNic and launched .uk.com on an unsuspecting world.

I think .uk.com with some clever marketing could really benefit as an alternative, especially if Nominet fudge the issue by creating uncertainity that you could loose your .co.uk later to a .uk.

Businesses that need to reduce risk in protecting a domain name brand may find they can get the .uk.com name they want.

 

[anthony]

Nominet. Acorn is mainly a self-selected group of people who are primarily involved in the secondary market. The opening up of .uk affects more than just players in the secondary market and the Nominet forum is read by people who won't be reading the discussions here.

But you still have to be a member of Nominet to join it, so that excludes anyone else. Hardly balanced either to my mind!

 

[Hazel Pegg]

But you still have to be a member of Nominet to join it, so that excludes anyone else. Hardly balanced either to my mind!

Maybe one of the more tech savvy bods could set up an open forum?

 

[Stephen]

Original proposal: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3257_dotukrevisited.pdf (if anyone's following the debate on the Nominet Forum you'll find it came from a very familiar name)

PAB meeting that references it: http://www.mydomainnames.co.uk/3255_PAB_meeting_Jan_05.pdf

Even though the report had a very biased agenda it did show its real reasons for the indtroduction of .uk and who would really benefit plus it was intended for an audience of industry experts.

It did come with a severe health warning which was;

“The negative effects revolve around the fact that there is an existing structure:
1. Companies have invested money in building brands around .co.uk names.
2. People have come to understand and trust the meaning of SLDs and the structure itself.
3. Companies might take the introduction of a change as an opportunity to switch to another domain such as .eu or .com.

The main negative, which is the standard argument against all change, is that the change itself will cause confusion and cost. This argument requires careful consideration.”​

Whereas the current .uk proposal fails to offer any negative aspects or concerns, with an audience that simply will not know the weaknesses and dangers of this curent .uk proposal.

Plus all those concerns raised in 2004 are even more valid now, especially as nominet itself has been promoting the use of .co.uk through it's a great place to be campaign.

Rgds
Stephen

 

[Edwin]

Yes. In 2004 there were less than half as many .co.uk domains registered as today, plus we've had 8 more years of branding the extension!

 

[Edwin]

It's also telling that a 2004 proposal written by someone with a pro change agenda nevertheless quotes a £30 million revenue figure (implicit: to Nominet) and suggests a takeup in the millions...

 

[Stephen]

From the introduction of the 2004 report.

This is a proposal to open up the second level under .UK to all, in a way which solves a lot of intellectual property issues, resolves some competition law problems and should prove a financial shot in the arm for Nominet members, trade mark companies and those involved in intellectual property issues.

No mention of the uk economy or registrants but a lot of self interest which are not domainers for a change!

 

[julian]

PS - I have received several offers for glastonbury.co.uk and turned them all down

Why??!

 

[foz]

Which is going to be best to post on Acorn or Nominet, to get a real debate and insight into the issues?

Would say Acorn as it is a public forum. Theirs more activity here than at the Nominet forum, of which represents Registrars on the whole.

 

[Stephen]

I would just like too add about the comment on New potential .co.uk registrants that the advise given to businesses wanting to register a domain from experts and lawyers would be dont use .co.uk as you may not, whatever you do get the .uk when Nominet eventually launch it.

It would be sad day indeed.

Edwin - After your posting of the NZ consultation result (together with all the feedback/observation from the Nominet 3 days) I now believe that Nominet will shelve the idea of .uk and state they will revisit it at a future time. (although I have not given up getting the message out there)

When asked about the harm the proposal has done they will state “what’s all the fuss been about, it was only a consultation”.

I think this is incorrect viewpoint as businesses anticipate risk and by not concluding the position fully, here are some ideas on what might happen over time;

Existing .co.uk owners:

1. Might move over to .com (some of which they already own but have preferred until now to use their .co.uk) as it is known they cannot undermine you at a later date, as it is already a second level tld.

2. Consider moving to one of the new or existing alternative GLT’s – as uk namespace is seen as unsecure as Nominet have stated that .co.uk is not secure by inference.

3. Some extreme move may be to secure own tld like .bbc and them moving away from the uk namespace would send a very poor message to the wider business community

4. Not to so likely but some exporters/service companies may consider using .eu

5. The owners of .uk.net and .uk.com may decide this is time to get a few more registrants in the confusion.​

New .co.uk registrants:

Why built up a .co.uk brand if having the .co.uk domain, trading in the uk, having a uk trademark would not ensure you received the preferential .uk equivalent when it eventually was introduced.​

All the above I believe would change the direction and fortune of the uk namespace.

There is a bit more, but you start to get the picture of a “post failed .uk consultation”.