.UK Announced

[anthony]

Or give it to the oldest registrant (there's precedent in 12 other countries) which would negate all auctions...

That certainly has legs, anything to stop Nominet draining millions out of competing interested parties.

 

[willbon]

....................

 

[Stephen]

Or give it to the oldest registrant (there's precedent in 12 other countries) which would negate all auctions.

If this was done, I think Nominet would have a cut off date of recent changes of owners would not count to securing rights to the .uk, which running some real life scenarios would still create some unfairness.

 

[Brassneck]

You go through all that and then state the obvious that they are not a government department so all you say is nothing to do with insight from a civil servant. And when it comes to vested interests none have more than nominet themselves and some board members, so I'm afraid you liking this to a government introduced enquiry or consultation has little credibility.

Yup I probably talked a load of crap. Having said that this page - http://www.nominet.org.uk/whoweare/whatwedo/partnerships - suggests that Nominet does at least have some characteristics which require good governance and the recent review by BIS suggests that Nominet would be pretty stupid not to have upped its performance in this area.

Stephen.

 

[Stephen]

Analogy

I wonder if the government might take this idea of selling something you have already sold and changing the "company namespace" by introducing a new concept of "corporations" in addition to ltd companies, sole traders and partnership and internet business names and trademark holders.

All interested parties could bid for them at auction (that most will not know about) and if they dont get them, they can buy them later from the new "corporation" owner as these new corporations will be trusted more than limited companies, so eventually it will become important for ltd companies to own the equivalent corporation name!

 

[websaway]

Yup I probably talked a load of crap. Having said that this page - http://www.nominet.org.uk/whoweare/whatwedo/partnerships - suggests that Nominet does at least have some characteristics which require good governance and the recent review by BIS suggests that Nominet would be pretty stupid not to have upped its performance in this area.

Stephen.

I'm certainly not suggesting you're talking the way you say.
I'm making it clear that this is not a government department led enquiry or consultation. It's an exercise being carried out by the entity which stands to gain most by it's introduction, so not in the least neutral or independant and not to be relied upon for producing honest structured findings at the end. More likely to find ways of steering it through.

 

[Stephen]

Motives

So Stephen, if you don't mind me asking, is your main objection to the .uk introduction the fact that it may devalue some domains you already own?

Aegean

"the fact that is would devalue a large section of .co.uk portfolio" is not my main objection to the .uk proposal, is the short answer.

I really believe that the .uk proposal is ill conveived and will not acheive its core objectives of helping the uk economy and helping make the uk interently a more secure place. In fact I believe it will do exactly the opposite if it goes ahead in its current form.

I would have prefered Nominet to start a real debate on how the uk internet can grow and possible be a world/global player like it is in banking (not the best example maybe) as well as fullfill the needs of the uk consumers more effectively and how the uk interent could be made to be a much safer place.

Rgds
Stephen

 

[foz]

When they analyse the responses they will most likely categorise responders into groups - e.g. 'real' businesses, domainers, Joe Public, etc and will try to see what themes occur within the groups and across the groups. If there is broad agreement then probably easy for them to decide what to do - if not, then they will start to weight strength of responses by perceived importance of each group.

Will a wide range of groups be responding? A great deal of them will be Registrars, Members, Domainers and Developers. What measures have Nominet taken to get the word out about the consultation? A few press statements won't cut it.

 

[GreyWing]

Will a wide range of groups be responding? A great deal of them will be Registrars, Members, Domainers and Developers. What measures have Nominet taken to get the word out about the consultation? A few press statements won't cut it.

Nor did I get an answer to whether Nominet would be launching a big campaign to tell people about the auctions.

Budget for promoting consultation = 2 magic beans a cow and pot plant
Budget for promoting auctions = kitchen sink and someone's gran

 

[tifosi]

For the vast majority of uk domain holders the end-point is the registrar. They don't know, have never heard of, and don't care who Nominet are. They just know who they pay to renew their domain and/or their hosting at the end of the month(ish).

If Nominet can't/won't send out a mailshot then they should at least get ther registrar members to to so - in the strongest terms possible.

Only that way will any sort of balanced concensus be reached.

 

[Edwin]

Sorry, completely reworked the "Pros and Cons" from a few hours ago to make them much simpler and easier to follow. So it might be worth a second look...
www.mydomainnames.co.uk/pros-and-cons.html

 

[sdsinc]

For example, I had a business customer of mine with 10 bike shops interested in bikes.co.uk for his business. However bikes.co.uk is controlled by a domain leasing company and unless you are willing to lease the name you won't get it. Bikes.org.uk is owned by someone else, as are bikes.me.uk and bikes.com. So whats the problem if he buys bikes.uk?

The real reason: in the long haul it can be expected that .uk will become the default extension. That won't happen overnight for sure. It could take one or two decades for the shift to take place but I think it will ultimately happen.

But .org.uk or .me.uk are not on par with .co.uk and never will. They cannot be considered competitors to .co.uk/.uk.

In recent years many countries have made second level registrations available. As such the move toward .uk is not a never before seen scenario. What makes the UK case special is the highly developed TLD and huge amount of 'legacy' namespace.
In India I believe .in is now more mainstream than .co.in. Those who missed the .in boat in 2005 are going to start regretting it.

On the other hand, in Mexico I believe .com.mx still is more popular than .mx, ditto for South/Central American countries. But it's only a question of time.

For me personally, It does look like domainers trying to protect their own investments, rather than any genuine objection to an inevitable improvement of the UK domain name system. Sorry but thats how it seems, not one argument I have seen makes any sense in the business world.

Every business owner should be concerned, if they are in for the long haul...
It's like you have a store on High Street, then the traffic (and pedestrian areas) are gradually moved to New Street. Then your Street becomes a Yard and there's nothing you can do. You can only hope to buy your ticket out of the ghetto.

 

[foz]

Funds seem to be flowing with participating Registrars in promoting AGreatPlaceToBe.co.uk. Flogging an extension while they still can?

A note on the Short Domain auctions. A TM owner approached me demanding an explanation on how I registered a particular domain in September 2011. It was news to them that Nominet had released them. So I don't think Nominet did a very good job in this regard. And no they didn't bother taking it further with an offer to acquire.

 

[Sound]

I like some other members are happy for the launch of .uk and get a little pissed off when some people think that they represent the view of all members on the forum in the fight to stop .uk. I have been impressed by Edwin and Stephen's passion and dedication and its great for the forum to see the transparency of their views unlike others who think that meeting in secret and looking for legal loopholes is the answer.

I have always been a developer and have never had the desire to amass a large portfolio as I always believed that something would come along like Apps or other TLD's to water down its value over time.

Was always amazed at how lacking in business acumen Nominet was only a fool would have allowed so few people to hoover up thousands of suspended domains for one purpose only, to sell at a profit.

I have yet to see on any business forum any support for stopping the launch of .uk even on the affiliate forum http://www.affiliates4u.com it was meet with contempt for domainers

The people who will decided if this happens are the large Registrars and the government both of whom have much to gain and little to lose from the change.

I do wish people would stop scaremongering about TM holders, most TM holders will have very little interest in domains its not the reason they applied for a TM in the first place the only people who have been busy lately on the TM website are domainers looking for a loophole.

I also understand that unlike others I have very little to lose and much to gain.

 

[Edwin]

I do wish people would stop scaremongering about TM holders, most TM holders will have very little interest in domains its not the reason they applied for a TM in the first place the only people who have been busy lately on the TM website are domainers looking for a loophole.

There were quite a few representatives from TM consultants and companies that help firms manage their TM assets at the face-to-face consultations, and you could practically see them salivating at the prospect of getting their hands on super-prime domains for next to nothing.

So I'm afraid having witnessed that first hand, sat only a few metres away across the table from me, I'd take issue with your conclusion.

 

[foz]

The notion that late comers on a modest salary will have an opportunity to acquire premium .uk domains is ill conceived. Their are Domainers and Developers out there with Millions of dollars ready to pull the trigger if .uk comes to fruition.

 

[Stephen]

…… I have always been a developer and have never had the desire to amass a large portfolio as I always believed that something would come along like Apps or other TLD's to water down its value over time. …….

I have seen the arrival of .eu and lots of new GLT’s .mobi, .travel and a whole host of new tld’s coming and they provide alternatives for people, so effectively reduce the size of the aftermarket for .co.uk domains and hence reduce the price and I can live with all that.

But I thought I had obtained in .co.uk the premier uk business address for the internet and do not expect Nominet to undermine that.

…….Was always amazed at how lacking in business acumen Nominet was only a fool would have allowed so few people to hoover up thousands of suspended domains for one purpose only, to sell at a profit…….

Agree (even though I have caught lots of nice names) and at the Nominet round table I requested that as their expiring domain name consultation has not published the results, they look at it again to see if more can be done to allow trademark holders and currently trading businesses more opportunity to have those expiring names they require.

I have yet to see on any business forum any support for stopping the launch of .uk even on the affiliate forum http://www.affiliates4u.com it was meet with contempt for domainers…..

If they hate domainers now, just think what it will be like when the 1,000,000 plus (my guess) .co.uk owners and other parties with an interest in certain domains, find they have been obtained by several huge corporations.

The people who will decided if this happens are the large Registrars and the government both of whom have much to gain and little to lose from the change.

Even though I have been in business 30 years and have had my share of being shafted, I believe that the truth will come out (whatever that is) at Nominet and they will eventually make the right decision.

Rgds
Stephen

 

[GreyWing]

I like some other members are happy for the launch of .uk and get a little pissed off when some people think that they represent the view of all members on the forum in the fight to stop .uk. I have been impressed by Edwin and Stephen's passion and dedication and its great for the forum to see the transparency of their views unlike others who think that meeting in secret and looking for legal loopholes is the answer.

If transparency if what you want, why not ask Nominet to publish all the consultations and then we can all see where we stand (minority of majority).

How would you know what we are doing if we are doing it in secret, therefore how can you judge if it is the answer or not?

 

[Sound]

If transparency if what you want, why not ask Nominet to publish all the consultations and then we can all see where we stand (minority of majority).

How would you know what we are doing if we are doing it in secret, therefore how can you judge if it is the answer or not?

Because you keep telling us that's what's happening.

 

[Sound]

There were quite a few representatives from TM consultants and companies that help firms manage their TM assets at the face-to-face consultations, and you could practically see them salivating at the prospect of getting their hands on super-prime domains for next to nothing.

So I'm afraid having witnessed that first hand, sat only a few metres away across the table from me, I'd take issue with your conclusion.

How many domains do you believe you will lose if it happens? it didn't happen on mass for the LL.co.uk.

Scott was clever but was ill treated by some jealous members and no longer posts on here a sad loss