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.UK V2 - The Losers

Discussion in 'Domain Research' started by Murray, Jun 27, 2013.

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  1. scooter United Kingdom

    scooter Well-Known Member

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    We digress,

    My question was:
    If Monkey only has 2 names and he has forked out £37K on these is he going to be happy if someone with exactly the same business model is given a better extention (they may even get them for £5), will he be happy?





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  2. Domain Forum

    Acorn Domains Elite Member

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  3. Retired_Member42

    Retired_Member42 Retired Member

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    I'm not saying he's going to be happy. Who would be? Same as I wouldn't be happy if someone got .uk because their unused .co.uk was older than my .org.uk. Same as I wouldn't be happy if I lost a number one spot in Google to a competitor... Not being happy is fair enough, but I don't think it's the end of the world scenario as it's made out to be here. He's paid £37k for some names as he obviously sees value in them and they're fit for purpose for his business model. He's not lost £37k as he still owns the domains he's bought and his business is still in the same place as it was before or after the .uk launch. The only people who lose anything as such are domainers who are sitting on .co.uk and not getting .uk for a freebie. Even then it's not a loss, only less profit.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2013
  4. domainseller200 United Kingdom

    domainseller200 Well-Known Member

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    I am sick of hearing all the "fair" and "unfair" comments in this Nominet .uk proposal. Life isn't fair and whinging about things which are fair and unfair won't solve anything. A child dying of cancer is one of the most unfair things in the world, it still happens though and arguing over how unfair it is, doesn't stop it from happening.

    Play the hand you are dealt, walk the paths you have chosen and stop whinging - you could die tomorrow.
     
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  5. scooter United Kingdom

    scooter Well-Known Member

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    I too am sick of and it. There are about 400 posts of, sick, fair, unfair and what ifs.

    There would be none if Nominet didn't try to fix something that did not need fixed.

    As for the hand you are dealt. We were going to be given a £20 reg fee for something that was not required. That hand has now gone as pressure dealt with it. The path they chose us to walk closed.

    I'll be the first to go with the flow once the final hand has been dealt but no hand has been dealt. The hand has only changed and proposed. Like the first hand, we are at a crossroads, the path has still to be chosen. Maybe pressure will prevail again.




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    Last edited: Jun 28, 2013
  6. domainseller200 United Kingdom

    domainseller200 Well-Known Member

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    Hence my comment play the hand you are dealt - when it is ACTUALLY dealt :)
     
  7. foz

    foz Well-Known Member

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    When it comes to .uk, it's a high card hand or at best one pair.
     
  8. Retired_Member42

    Retired_Member42 Retired Member

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    Come on Frank, have a bit of a whinge. That's what this thread is for.
     
  9. domainseller200 United Kingdom

    domainseller200 Well-Known Member

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    That was my whinge :p
     
  10. Murray

    Murray Well-Known Member

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    Well that wasn't necessarily my intention :p

    Just wanted to highlight just a little bit of how much has been invested into the premium .uk only for it's premium status to be tarnished by even the very proposition of direct.uk
     
  11. Retired_Member38

    Retired_Member38 Banned

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    Realistically, who is going to do this? It would be nothing more than idiotic to attempt to build a car insurance site on Monkey.uk, when there was an established car insurance site on the .co.uk.

    There is absolutely no chance that any big company tries to turn Monkey.uk into a big brand in the car insurance niche. If they are big company already, then they should be launching a new site with the expectation of dominating the niche. Why would they possibly want to launch and win in a niche like that, then leak loads of traffic to me on the .co.uk? They'd go look for a combo of butterfly.co.uk/.uk, or any other suitable pair. They wouldn't want to throw away 100's of thousands of pounds on the alternate solution of building a site that co-exists next to mine, and me getting traffic they had earned.


    Speaking from a friends recent experience, I wouldn't even bother with a DRS. Just go down the 'passing off' route. The threat of burying someone in legal expenses and the other side of the table being occupied by someone with deep pockets was enough for this one to be turned over when the complaint was complete bullshit to begin with. A big company isn't going to build on one half of a .co.uk/.uk pair as its not worth it. A little guy isn't going to do it in case someone flattens them with legal expenses. So this isn't nearly the issue you're making it out to be, imho.






    Yes but again, why would anyone bother? If they have the resources to compete for the money keywords, they'd certainly not want to be confused by another site already operating. The only way they'd want to cause this confusion, was because they wanted to force me to buy them out. And its not going to be anywhere near as cheap and easy as you think it would be to do that.



    It wouldn't be very hard no. But you'd need to spend 5 figures to do it. With again all the issues of if you have the resources to do it, you'd be building your own brand and not trying to piggy back off someone else's.

    How many domainers have either the ability or the resources to spend 5 figures a go, trying to extort multiple big websites into buying them out? The chances of anyone attempting this is close to zero. You'd need to spend a million £ to even attempt it to 20 different sites. And if you tried it to 20 sites, that in itself would be clear evidence of bad faith registrations and use of domains.
     
  12. websaway United Kingdom

    websaway Well-Known Member

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    I think everyone is arguing about the seating arrangements.
    The cards are yet to be dealt.

    But I do know what you mean, it's a marathon not a sprint.
     
  13. Murray

    Murray Well-Known Member

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    It's lucky you weren't Rosa Parks lol.
     
  14. scooter United Kingdom

    scooter Well-Known Member

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    I agree. I'm tired of it all. We could easily have another 400 pages of arguing "what if" scenarios. Lets see what the cards say.

    But i do agree with what you stated in one of the threads earlier. If it does go ahead all it will be is a mirror of what is already here. All good names taken and you are left with what is already left in the co.uk name space.



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  15. invincible

    invincible Well-Known Member

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    *In your opinion.* :) Don't assume everyone else would think the same. Until it actually happens it's probably pointless arguing about it though!

    That's an expensive route with a high threshold required to proof passing off. Is "monkey.co.uk" really so well known to expect that most people would immediately think of your brand when seeing the "monkey" term in association with car insurance? Until you started posting about it on here I'd never heard of your brand. You're not "Coke". :)

    Again, *in your opinion*. :) What about if an FCORP, where you didn't know who the beneficial owner was and you didn't know the depth of their resources, decided to do so? I know of individuals controlling companies who might relish the chance of wallpapering your home with legal documents and would make you think twice about pursuing then in court. Even if you won a case of passing off, after an expensive legal case dragging out for a year, you wouldn't necessarily obtain all of your costs.

    You shouldn't try too hard to second guess why others choose to do things which you wouldn't necessarily do because you will be at it all day! :)

    Maybe that entity could easily do both ther own seperate site and a copy-cat "monkey" site. It doesn't take long to knock up such sites so there's only a small cost in doing both. If it made money, and wound you up in the process, maybe that would satisfy them enough! :)

    from iPhone)
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2013
  16. Retired_Member38

    Retired_Member38 Banned

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    Sure, but it makes sense to at least think through possible outcomes in advance. Its a better option than waiting till it affects you, and you don't have any idea what you're going to do about it.


    There wouldn't be a high threshold of proof if someone tried it on multiple people at once. I'm not saying Monkey is a big brand - its clearly not. But if they tried it on me and a dozen other people... the bad faith in what they are doing would be painfully obvious.
     
  17. invincible

    invincible Well-Known Member

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    Yes and no because you will drive yourself crazy!:) You just cannot really know what you'd do until you knew who you were going to be fighting. You'd obviously hope you just got the matching domain name.

    Are you thinking about One in a Million here? :) A smart person might spread the risk across multiple entities requiring you to prove that they were linked. Good luck! :) If you could think of a way around everything you're suggesting, so can others.




    (from iPhone)
     
  18. Retired_Member38

    Retired_Member38 Banned

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    The situation Scooter was suggesting was a near impossibility from the start. I"m pretty much only answering it out of boredom.

    If anyone was going to do this spread across multiple personalities then it would be absolutely impossible for them to get all the .uk's in the first place without leaving a clear trail of them being connected to one person or group surely.

    Anyway no more pie in the sky theories for me. I'm off to watch a program about a mixed race couple, their 'little chocolate babies', and Stephen Fry.
     
  19. scooter United Kingdom

    scooter Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't talking about one entity doing multiple sites.. No need. People will be queuing up to take on a site or 2 only.

    Plan wisely. Get the dominant domain, Spend £170, get the trademark and build as co.uk will become the poor mans .uk through time. just like the org.uk is at present.

    But as you say, it is all pie in the sky until we see the cards.



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  20. Retired_Member38

    Retired_Member38 Banned

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    This is speculation. If Google etc stay on .co.uk... then there is only one winner and it aint the new kid in town.
     
  21. scooter United Kingdom

    scooter Well-Known Member

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    Everything is speculation. it is all pie in the sky.
     
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