20i Reseller Hosting

Closed thread?

Discussion in 'The Bar' started by dropsnatcher, Jan 18, 2020.

  1. Ben Thomas

    Ben Thomas Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2018
    Posts:
    1,312
    Likes Received:
    149
    That’s an interesting concept.
     
  2. Domain Forum

    Acorn Domains Elite Member

    Joined:
    1999
    Messages:
    Many
    Likes Received:
    Lots
    articles.co.uk
     
  3. Murray

    Murray Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2012
    Posts:
    3,920
    Likes Received:
    333
    At the moment, the only change to Nominet rules (assuming they start to enforce them) to make it 100% fair would be you can only chase with a script you made yourself

    Then it would be down to individual ability and time put into perfecting your own script

    That would reward the people that deserve to be rewarded

    No one deserves a trophy just for turning up
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. WalkinDude United Kingdom

    WalkinDude Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2012
    Posts:
    916
    Likes Received:
    43
    And no one deserves perpetual advantage just for getting the noses in first.
     
  5. Murray

    Murray Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2012
    Posts:
    3,920
    Likes Received:
    333
    I'm not sure how this relates to what I posted?
     
  6. anthony United Kingdom

    anthony Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2006
    Posts:
    1,796
    Likes Received:
    39
    You need to read through your post again Jack, it screams self interest!
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  7. Ben Thomas

    Ben Thomas Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2018
    Posts:
    1,312
    Likes Received:
    149
    Without being rude, or coming across as such, I think it's important to remember people make a living from this industry (myself included). Taking that away from people is undoubtedly going to stir up some worries, in that case, I think self-interest is warranted.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  8. stitchbob

    stitchbob Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2019
    Posts:
    294
    Likes Received:
    32
    i can assure you that you can still be competitive while rotating. The only DAC poll that counts is the one that says the domain has dropped, the 1000 before that are irrelevant.

    Its like playing roulette, but removing the winning number from the wheel after each spin. Your chance of hitting the right number increases as the numbers thin out, but any individual number has an equal chance of dropping at any one time. It’s irrelevant whether you’re putting your money on zero every spin or changing it each time.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. anthony United Kingdom

    anthony Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2006
    Posts:
    1,796
    Likes Received:
    39
    Hi Ben,

    I fully appreciate that. However, the system as it stands isn't fair enough to the public, which makes self-interest a conflicting stance with those who have waited for years for Nominet to focus its efforts on serving the public. Personally, if i pay £100 for a domain name, I couldn't give a monkey's uncle who's pocket it ends up in. Catching was something that evolved on the fringe, it wasn't there to be served by Nominet. An auction model is a far more attractive proposition, and most catchers already hold a vast amount of domains that are more than enough to line their pockets with gold.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. WalkinDude United Kingdom

    WalkinDude Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2012
    Posts:
    916
    Likes Received:
    43
    Very lengthy thread earlier which broadly stated dropcatching days as is numbered. I skim read it. Im on my phone at mo.

    This thread seems to have disappeared. Im opposed to nominet auctioning off all uk dropped domains for their own coffers including any promises 5% will go to charity. I also think current system favouring genius computer programmers is also unfair but better than proposed nominet auction system.

    Im not even a registrar so no offence intended by any comment I make.
     
  11. Murray

    Murray Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2012
    Posts:
    3,920
    Likes Received:
    333
    It's totally without any self-interest, otherwise I'd prefer it just to stay as is (with Nominet enforcing their own rules)

    I don't know how to write a script, I've used hosted systems and bought scripts so I'd also be out of luck
     
  12. signature

    signature Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2013
    Posts:
    1,478
    Likes Received:
    37
    Auction does not change much, this is what many extensions uses already, wider public are only interest in a domain when they need one and auction will still be dominated by most of the people here.

    This will only favour people with bigger wallet and not the public. Every .COM/.NET/.ORG and may like that goes through auctions everyday.

    A lot of my none .UK domains are bought through auction and majority of buyers are domain investors.

    if .UK follow the same route it will be us here that will be doing most of the buying, not the public and it will be the large registrars that will be running the auction not Nominet and not the current small domainers either. Now more mouth are fed with the current process, if new process takes thing away to the large registrars, only the already well fed will benefit.
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
    • Like Like x 1
  13. starbird United Kingdom

    starbird Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2019
    Posts:
    57
    Likes Received:
    11
    The public couldn't care less about domains. They go to google, search, click on the top results. You will have the same buyers, just they'll pay more if, in the highly unlikely event, Nominet do go with an auction model. What I do see happens is the big registrars will have the ability to retain domains after say 30 days. The registrant may still be able to renew as per Nominet's rules but they will not drop but be auctioned off on the registrars site instead.

    Truth is no one knows and I'd be confident no one here wants any changes until well after October (after the June drop and likely October drop as well).

    After that it's everyone fighting for the same handful of names again but there are real opportunities for most to get good names with the huge drop in June.
     
  14. Ben Thomas

    Ben Thomas Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2018
    Posts:
    1,312
    Likes Received:
    149
    In my experience, price is never an issue to someone who really wants to buy something. If you sell it properly, the price is irrelevant. Any good salesperson will tell you the same. So the idea that making the whole thing a registry controlled auction operation is pointless with the sole motive to make it more easily accessible to the public, because it won't change a thing aside from taking all of us out of the picture. Whether I have example.uk for sale or Nominet have example.uk for auction doesn't matter, if Bob from Example Industries wants the domain name, he will buy it regardless of cost.
     
  15. Whois-Search United Kingdom

    Whois-Search Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2004
    Posts:
    1,914
    Likes Received:
    109
    Can you imagine your average person looking through a drop list this week ....

    Total .uk dropped
    122,303 - 2020-01-20
    125,239 - 2020-01-19
    101,498 - 2020-01-18
    80,608 - 2020-01-17
    24,244 - 2020-01-16
    419 - 2020-01-15
    27,482 - 2020-01-14
    30,187 - 2020-01-13
    15,958 - 2020-01-12

    I think Nominet might be too late ... at this rate there will be nothing left :(
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2020
  16. Siusaidh United Kingdom

    Siusaidh Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2019
    Posts:
    603
    Likes Received:
    175
    The Registry is haemorrhaging .uk domains, because the 'free registrations' last year only acted to temporarily create the impression of 'growth' in that area. When you add the further collapse in June, I suspect the .uk total will have dropped by approaching a million names in the year (because most of those domains are useless trash). If Nominet want growth I think they will probably find it, if at all, in security systems and diversification. Otherwise, its domain market looks like slowly contracting further, even after the .uk numerical collapse this year.

    With regard to the average person or average business looking for particular domains, they will tend to be looking for specific names or keywords, and they'd use a search option on an expiring domains list. As I see it, with an auction system there would be two stages. First the very large list which would need to be searched. Second, the shortlist of names people have actually bid on to trigger an active auction.

    In the end, many people would be scanning down that far smaller number of domains where an auction has been triggered by the first bid. However, all this is speculative because I agree with you about most likely outcomes.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. anthony United Kingdom

    anthony Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2006
    Posts:
    1,796
    Likes Received:
    39
    Has Nominet ever done the research to determine what the rolling percentage is of all UK domain names that are actually being used? I'd be surprised if they haven't, and I also suspect it makes for dire reading. I'm not on about the single page plus email usage setups, but 'proper' web sites! You can see the bigger registrars promoting their value in TV advertising, maybe they are the ones who would be best placed to run a forced auction process, as they at least are reaching out to the public. Whether or not that convinces the younger crowd to think again of other options than the social media platforms to market themselves, only time will tell.
     
  18. Fred Steven Cyprus

    Fred Steven Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2020
    Posts:
    13
    Likes Received:
    4
    • Agree Agree x 2
  19. starbird United Kingdom

    starbird Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2019
    Posts:
    57
    Likes Received:
    11
    The big registrars have the artificial hike in numbers by regging names of all the .co.uk domains under them, without consent, hoping people would buy them, it didn't work. 95% are names no one will ever use, we're just chasing the 5%. After June and likely October (drops from first 2 weeks of July), the party is over.

    A lot of good names going to auction way too quick and are well worth buying for what they are selling for.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Whois-Search United Kingdom

    Whois-Search Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2004
    Posts:
    1,914
    Likes Received:
    109
    Yes the whole extension .uk is built on free names. From the figures I’ve seen 1 million are dropping right now from 123-Reg etc

    The drop has only just started this week:

    111,617 - 2020-01-21

    Then yes another million will drop in June from Fasthosts and 1&1: https://3million.uk/ror-stats/

    Registries tend to provide the bulk data as a download:
    https://afilias.com.au/about-au/domain-drop-lists

    Otherwise a name could have been renewed by the time its on auction. The drop list will be a snapshot in time of expiring names that is 30 days out saying what will drop on a certain date. It will still need checking and filtering again by registrars.

    Having run one of those sites myself in the past (15 years ago):
    https://web.archive.org/web/20060111041740/http://deleting.co.uk/

    A lot of work goes in to the filtering of names from a drop list - eg. The names selling (at auction) the moment are SEO traffic names with DA and PA. Only the domainers here are experienced enough to filter the raw data. Who would have picked BlueTack.co.uk yesterday?

    Only if it was a DVLA style auction where a set of premium names (flowers.uk etc) were promoted:

    https://dvlaregistrations.dvla.gov.uk/auction/

    The problem you have with auctioning expired domain names is they are not a fixed asset. They can be renewed , get deleted , or drop before the auction is promoted.

    You then end up with a auction like Catch Tiger where effectively it’s a pre-bid on something they might get:
    https://www.catchtiger.com/en/domain-auctions/

    I know Nominet would have it to start with but the Registrant might renew it etc
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2020
  21. Hay

    Hay Active Member Exclusive Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2019
    Posts:
    208
    Likes Received:
    28
    The Bulgarians / Tool.Domains / Seo.Domains are bang at it with there 20 million tags running in sync around the clock, ive been analysing every request and between nominet so i can see exactly when they are sending their EPP requests based on the returned ID's... They must be running in sync... Here are some more culprit tags to add the the rest of their fake tags:

    Antoniya Pavlova [Tag = APAVLOVA]
    DotSensei Ltd. [Tag = DOTSENSEI]

    Further breakdown: https://companycheck.co.uk/company/...ompanies-house-data#directors-and-secretaries

    I could go much deeper and link all their staff / directors to all their accounts but really cant be bothered as its too blatant anyway, all you need to do is look at the director database (not the link through on companies house but the actual downloadable persons of significance database)

    There is having a competitive script and outright taking the piss!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1